Why TCU doesn't get 5-Star players.

[JimSwinkLives!]

I will have to echo what Feisty wrote. Two things, in my humble opinion, should stand out here:

1) We will continue to win games and go to bowls, even without JG. We were winning without JG before, and we will still win with him at UT.

2) Our recruiting success continues to rise every year. As has already been stated by Feisty and others, were are getting closer and closer to grabbing some 5-star, elite athletes. Several years ago, these kids wouldn't even let us through the front door. Now, we are in their living rooms and are very much a part of the equation. Yes, its frustrating not to get a high profile kid like JG, but if our on-field success continues like it should over the next 2-3 years, I have no doubt that we will start to land some of these types of players. Its not something that happens overnight, but its a process, and we are getting closer to seeing it through.

Go Frogs!

 

[West Coast Johnny]

A few points about TCU recruiting:

-Anyone who says that Texas' recruiting classes are over rated is insulting Gary Patterson's evaluation skills. He has offered dozens of UT players over the years and have landed very few. Tanner Brock, Jeremy Kerely, *Griffin Gilbert* come to mind. Stop talking about how TCU actually has better tallent than Texas cuz Gary has offered dozens of Horns. Texas doesn't lack talent, it just doesn't know what to do with what it has.

-I don't care how many BCS games we go to, I don't see a scenario where we're all of a sudden getting committments from multiple national top 100 players like Alabama, USC, or Texas. Multiple national championships might move the needle in that direction, but bowl games won't.

-TCU is still a big fish in a small pond. Most blue chip recruits don't want to play in the MWC against the bottom half of college football. The Big East is only a tiny step in the right direction.

-We're building a program not a team and it is a marathon not a sprint. The Rose bowl team was comprised of kids ranked 100 - 200 in the state of Texas. Are current recruits are primarily 50 - 150. We used to recruit against Houston, Rice, and Tulsa. Now we recruit (primarily) against Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, and A&M. Its an improvement, but a slow process.

-TCU has been a big winner in the decommit game. We've lost a few (Josh Huff), but gained many more (Jon Lewis, Brandon Carter, Carter Wall).

-I'll be honest with you guys, I'm worried that we've whiffed on some of our prime targets and no one on our offer list seems to be a sure thing. We're in the Top 3 or so of a bunch of good players but we I can't say that we are the clear leader for any of them. This incudes Devall, Wheeler, Starts, McNeal, Lawry, Fuller, and Vaitai.

 

[FeistyFrog]

A few points about TCU recruiting:

--TCU has been a big winner in the decommit game. We've lost a few (Josh Huff), but gained many more (Jon Lewis, Brandon Carter, Carter Wall).

Ethan Grant

 

[ShivasFrog]

1) We will continue to win games and go to bowls, even without JG. We were winning without JG before, and we will still win with him at UT.

2) Our recruiting success continues to rise every year. As has already been stated by Feisty and others, were are getting closer and closer to grabbing some 5-star, elite athletes. Several years ago, these kids wouldn't even let us through the front door. Now, we are in their living rooms and are very much a part of the equation. Yes, its frustrating not to get a high profile kid like JG, but if our on-field success continues like it should over the next 2-3 years, I have no doubt that we will start to land some of these types of players. Its not something that happens overnight, but its a process, and we are getting closer to seeing it through.

+1

Not all 4/5-stars are prima donnas. There are some TCU-types out there and that's who CGP will continue to recruit. I see Gray as a TCU-type, he just elected to go the UT route. Win some, lose some, but the overall recruiting trend is hugely positive and is just going to improve over time.

 

[Young and Horned]

I highly doubt Gray is a prima donna, but I can see where others could be.

 

[RaiderHater]

Honestly I think recruiting 5-star players is very overrated. According to ESPN this year only the top 14 players were given 5-stars.

So is the 15th best player in the country worse than the 14th best player? I think any 4-star player has the potential to compete on the highest level and possibly the NFL.

You also have to remember that these rating systems are based a lot off of what schools offer the player a scholarship.

 

[West Coast Johnny]

Ethan Grant

Who was Ethan Grant committed to?

 

[FeistyFrog]

Honestly I think recruiting 5-star players is very overrated. According to ESPN this year only the top 14 players were given 5-stars.

So is the 15th best player in the country worse than the 14th best player? I think any 4-star player has the potential to compete on the highest level and possibly the NFL.

You also have to remember that these rating systems are based a lot off of what schools offer the player a scholarship.

Only 26 per Rivals and UT had 1, so as you are saying not getting one ins't the end of the world, but would be nice every once in a while. Per ESPN and Rivals a 5 star is a kid that should be able to come into a program and make an almost immediate impact. Here are the 5 stars from UT the last 5 years:

2006 Eddie Jones, Sergio Kindle (Jones basically didn't show until his SR year and then OK, Kindle was supposed to be Heisman potential but was a backup 1st 2 seasons and then moved to DE)
2007 Tray Allen, Curtis Brown (backup, all-world DB had 2 ints in his career)
2008 none
2009 Garrett Gilbert, Alex Okafor, Mason Walters (Gilbert #95 rated passer last season, Okafor been a no-show, Walters had an injury but recovered nicely last year)
2010 Jordan Hicks, Jackson Jeffcoat (too soon to tell but two combined for 38 tackles last year though Hicks had big game against Neb)

 

[FeistyFrog]

Who was Ethan Grant committed to?

Oregon, we switched him and then they took Huff.

 

[FeistyFrog]

2006 Eddie Jones, Sergio Kindle (Jones basically didn't show until his SR year and then OK, Kindle was supposed to be Heisman potential but was a backup 1st 2 seasons and then moved to DE)
2007 Tray Allen, Curtis Brown (backup, all-world DB had 2 ints in his career)

And of these 4 that graduated only Kindle was drafted (2nd round) and then ended his career doing what most UT players seem to do best these days.

 

[masterfrog]

Higher educational standards, I would think, would be an issue. Do any of you know what your admission standards are for football? I know USF has lost at least a half dozen players because they couldn't pass our review board....may be a reason why some of the lesser "mentally adept" players don't go to your school. Doesn't matter, if you have a coach who can win a Rose Bowl with 3 star, then I think you're fine.

No one else answered you, but I will. The admission standards for TCU athletes are significantly lower than for the student body in general. We have seen examples from the past few seasons of players getting into TCU who graduated in the fourth quarter of their high school graduating class. I would like to see how many end up graduating with that kind of academic background, but getting in isn't really a problem.

 

[ShreveFrog]

Myeah, well, sorry Gray isn't coming to the best program in Texas. 5stars would be nice. But I still like the guys with Frog Factor. Gimme a team of Daltons, Tanks, Bart Johnsons, etc., coached up by GP and company. That's a winner.

 

[MidlandFrog]

One thing to keep in mind when it comes to recruiting is that many if these kids that are highly rated come from big time programs. Programs like Aledo, Trinity, Dallas Skyline, and others have teams stocked with athletes and they have school districts that support the program. It is very similar to college in that someone like Gray, while great, is surrounded by D1 talent. A kid like Tank is the only player on his team in Sweeny and therefore gets overlooked or downgraded. Many of the 5 stars come from these programs, but they might be overhyped just like the kids from Ohio State and Florida are when they come out of college. I'll take Gary's eval over Rivals anyday!!!

 

[gohornedfrogs]

What if Mack Brown gets thrown out or re-assigned within the UT athletic department?

It's April 2011. Lots of things can happen in the next 10 months.

 

[Opintel]

What if Mack Brown gets thrown out or re-assigned within the UT athletic department?

It's April 2011. Lots of things can happen in the next 10 months.

If the Whornz don't win at least seven games (possibly eight), the Mack-Daddy thing may come to an end. I can see the shift happening; the pressure is huge.

Who might be "the guy"?

 

[FeistyFrog]

That's insane talk

 

[Opintel]

That's insane talk

That he might slide into management (officially)? Quite possible.

I may be a bit insane, however. Can't deny that...but sometimes it's such fun.

 

[2themax]

I mentioned those same thoughts in another thread, but worded it differently as to not offend anyone. Those guys who know they have talent and are being overlooked are the ones that fit here best. You have to have a strong work ethic to make it at TCU. Frogs tend to acclimate to the NFL more easily than Horns. Takes them on avg about 2-3 yrs to committ to the league. B Arakpo, A Ross, & E Thomas are exceptions, but all the others have had their share of problems.

 

[count_biffula]

While it would be nice to get a 5 star now and then, I wouldn't sweat it, the system GP has going is working. GP probably loses some because they dont like it when he tells them they're expected to get their degree and they might not end up playing the position they played in high school. I'll take what we have over what's going on at most of the schools that land all the 5 stars. Only one team finished ranked higher than our 3 stars last season and thats only because we didnt get the chance to play that one team. :wink:

 

[froghorn4]

A 5 star recruit that doesn't mind working hard and pushing himself harder and thus will not be detered by TCU's hard work ethic. I can see where a prima donna could would shy away from a hard-nose coach. I will say this, Gray works hard on and off the field and working hard at TCU did not deter him. He just wanted UT more. It didn't hurt that his HS HC loves UT either.

Gray's HS HC attends a lot of TCU games as a fan and used to coach at A&M Consolidated. The choice had nothing to do with Buchanan.