Eight
Member
not exactly ground breaking as this issue has been addressed multiple times and i don't think many here would disagree overall, but why are you worried about the recruiting class two years from now in the transfer portal era
2023 Recruiting Thread
- Thread starter Moose Stuff
- Start date
not exactly ground breaking as this issue has been addressed multiple times and i don't think many here would disagree overall, but why are you worried about the recruiting class two years from now in the transfer portal era
Palliative Care
Active Member
Possible validity to your data, but getting a quality QB will not happen to a 5-7 team. Given the hypothesis that top QB's want to be on a National Championship contender The question is what record would it take, (if any) that would attract such a guy to TCU. We lucked out with Boykin but it even took several years for that to happen, TCU has tried to recruit a Boykin type of QB ever since and failure has been the outcome because we never really got a true guy.
I am of the opinion that the only way to get a top performer is to snatch up a starting QB that finds himself out of a job because a new hot guy comes in and surpasses him right off the bat. Since Dykes has done this before, people are waiting for lightening to strike again here. This takes a lot of money and convincing and this comes before someone else snaps that guys up.
Can it happen? Sure but when will all the Stars align? Pun intended!
I am of the opinion that the only way to get a top performer is to snatch up a starting QB that finds himself out of a job because a new hot guy comes in and surpasses him right off the bat. Since Dykes has done this before, people are waiting for lightening to strike again here. This takes a lot of money and convincing and this comes before someone else snaps that guys up.
Can it happen? Sure but when will all the Stars align? Pun intended!
An-Cap Frog
Member
Bring me up to speed...ole chap.
An-Cap Frog
Member
We were 5-7 because we missed on talent evaluation or because we didn't get the guy we wanted? We've had plenty of 4-stars but what is our hit rate?
Eight
Member
check the site because the discussion about the frogs misses at quarterback has been discussed multiple times, but you didn't answer the question why you specifically asked about the recruiting class in 2-years
when you do look up the number of misses versus hits then go look at texas and ou in regards to their high school recruits the last decade. tcu has missed quite often, but they are hardly the only one it would seem have had this issue as well
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froginmn
Full Member
Already trashing UT's acquisitions of Ewers and Manning? I think one of them may be quality.
Eight
Member
an-cap consider the "golden era" of modern tcu football qb recruiting between 2006-2011
the frogs signed andy dalton, casey pachall, and trevone boykin and 4 other quarterback prospects
andy was helped out by a scheme that didn't put a huge amount of pressure on him until he grew into the position, casey flashed physical talent, could throw every pass and his issues off the field hurt this team in 2012 and 2013, and trevone flashed potential in the baylor game in 2012, seemed to regress in 2013 and then exploded in 2014-15 when he was put into a new offense by a staff who didn't recruit him
the classes between 2012-15 on paper look like a disaster, but we did get the mule who beat baylor basically throwing a screen to reagor and there was a fairly decent qb transfer in 2015
on paper 2016-18 were the three best back to back qb prospects tcu ever signed in robinson, rogers, and duggan. robinson flamed out, rogers damn near lost a leg in high school, and max has been a three year starter so are we talking missed evaluations? lack of development? poor scheme
how do you factor in that they were playing in a scheme dependent on them carrying the team unlike andy in his early years. heck, max for two season was carrying the load throwing and RUNNING the ball. tough to lay that on him or his recruitment
the frogs signed andy dalton, casey pachall, and trevone boykin and 4 other quarterback prospects
andy was helped out by a scheme that didn't put a huge amount of pressure on him until he grew into the position, casey flashed physical talent, could throw every pass and his issues off the field hurt this team in 2012 and 2013, and trevone flashed potential in the baylor game in 2012, seemed to regress in 2013 and then exploded in 2014-15 when he was put into a new offense by a staff who didn't recruit him
the classes between 2012-15 on paper look like a disaster, but we did get the mule who beat baylor basically throwing a screen to reagor and there was a fairly decent qb transfer in 2015
on paper 2016-18 were the three best back to back qb prospects tcu ever signed in robinson, rogers, and duggan. robinson flamed out, rogers damn near lost a leg in high school, and max has been a three year starter so are we talking missed evaluations? lack of development? poor scheme
how do you factor in that they were playing in a scheme dependent on them carrying the team unlike andy in his early years. heck, max for two season was carrying the load throwing and RUNNING the ball. tough to lay that on him or his recruitment
An-Cap Frog
Member
Is there a bigger [ Arschloch] than you on this board? I think not. To answer your question, I like TCU football, so I want a good QB.
Eight
Member
not really and you used a basic stat to build a premise, presumed it was because of bad quarterback play but from what i can tell didn't consider things such as scheme or internal issues for a year such as 2013, was given a thumbnail of frogs quarterback recruiting since 2006 which scratches the surface of what has been discussed on this site, and have yet to say why you are so focused on a recruiting class two years in the future when their is a young quarterback on the roster who has shown some potential, they brought in a recruit who i don't think anyone here as seen, and sonny has shown he isn't afraid to go get a transfer to play the position
Froggish
Active Member
Sonny has found good QB play at all of his stops. He took his shot at Brock Glenn in this cycle and made a good impression but then an avalanche of offers popped including LSU and Ohio St. QBs are the kind of recruits you have to be on several years in advance to really land. With this staff only getting to TCU 6 months ago they are trying to make up ground. I am told that the staff really wants to make sure they know what they have in Morris and Jackson (Both have 4 years to play) before looking to the Portal. Sonny is acutely aware that he can't win at TCU without good QB and strong line play.
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Eight
Member
what gets overlooked so much is just how bad a shape the frogs offensive line had fallen into just as they entered the big 12
eddie was at the end of his career and not in good shape, they lost horn in the drug bust, had a potential starter go academically ineligible two years in a row, tayo was going back and forth between tcu and byu w off field issues, and I believe hunt, collins, and big v all played/started as true freshmen in 2012
Froggish
Active Member
Good points. OL play has been erratic at best. We struggled to develop the position well. Seems like its been a combination of not recruiting enough guys and then having to wait until they've been in the program 4 cycles before they can crack the 2-deep as Jr or Srs. Just a very bad strategy when your not very good. I've talked about it before but volume and coaching is the most importantly two qualities to fielding solid OLs. Its such a developmental position that volume is almost more important than recruiting rankings. There needs to be 4-5 entering the program every year without fail.
HornyWartyToad
Active Member
Guess it's hard to stock up on that many O-line prospects when your HFC prioritizes scholarships going to swarms of guys who are 5'9" and "sneaky fast." Those guys hardly ever crack the starting O-line.
Froggish
Active Member
This program has signed only 19 HS OL and roughly 21 HS DL in the last 7 years. When you consider that about 30% of them never lasted more than 2 years in the program (which is the going rate around CFB), that means your left praying that the 2 guys left on each side of the trenches develop into something special. Bodies are extremely important in OL/DL. GP preferred trying to make JUCO kids patch his pipeline holes. Successful programs recruit the trenches well, keep tons of big bodies developing, and run off those who haven't emerged after year 3. That, a long with coaching the crap out of them, is the formula for great trench play.
Nick Danger
Active Member
On the other hand, UT has been loading up on OL for the last couple of years, far more than they'll need. They've already started to run off via Portal, some of their wash-outs from last year. Look for that trendy to continue for them, only running off increasingly better "rejects looking for playing time. I wouldn't be surprised to see the two recruits we were looking at this year (Goosby and Cojoe) to wind up portalling back to Fort Worth in a year or two!
HornyWartyToad
Active Member
It's honestly a bit difficult to fathom, letting it get to that point. I mean, if all us fanboys (and girls) could see it in the play on Saturdays and spot the problems on the roster, how could the coaches not??? I guess that's what comes of being, "defensive-minded," and hiring sycophantic assistants who understand that their survival comes from telling the HFC want he *wants* to hear, rather than what he *needs* to hear. I suspect the new regime will be vastly superior in that regard.
Just occurs to me now to wonder what my Organizational Behavior prof would have to say about all this. Would probably make a great case study to compare and contrast the two staffs.
Eight
Member
an example of what you speak is the two quarterback recruiting classes after max
gary wanted mobile quarterbacks because they posed an issue for his defense and there was nothing wrong with wanting quarterbacks who could do damage running the ball
problem is they recruited two years of guys who could run, but were very inaccurate throwing the ball which doesn't work in cumbie's offense and no max jokes because max is tom brady in terms of throwing the ball accurately compared to stephon brown
Eight
Member
no accident the program's best seasons in the big 12 coincided with their best group of offensive linemen
not sure what happened then that hasn't happened the last few years other than we haven't seen the physical development one would have hoped from a group with numerous 3+ years in a program
might be foolish on my part, but i do think there is some talent in the line and hope the combination of ricker, kaz, and improved nutrition pays dividends VERY quickly
Frog Attack II
Active Member
Liked for the use of the word "sycophantic"... which is so true! What's so bad is that while they were telling GP how great he was, we continued to be less prepared on the field than our opponent, we couldn't get the ball to our weapons more than a couple of times per game, we had no offensive identity, we had tons of fast small guys on defense that would get destroyed at the LOS, and transformed to a white collar attitude vs the blue collar one that got us here.
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