Kevin Sumlin out at A&M, preparations for dismissal

[frogs9497]

The only thing he can do is tarnish his legacy. If he continues to win, great, he was already winning at the P5 level at TCU. If he goes 8-4, he gets fired.

I think this certainly works in our favor. He does place his legacy at risk if he leaves and achieves something less than expected. I'm just not relying on job security as his reason for staying. At his age and what he'll have earned over the years here and potentially there (say over the next 4-5 years) would take him to his early 60s with more money than he could spend.

That said, I'd be surprised to see him leave. He has done and said just about everything to indicate otherwise. But as CGP has always told us, “never say never.”

 

[stbrab]

According to the USAToday Coach's salary database Jimbo Fisher is the 6th highest paid coach in college football at $5.7M a year. (http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/). How much more would A&M be willing to pay a new head coach?

Why would Jimbo Fisher leave a school that he has built back up. He won a national championship in 2013, played in the CFP in 2014, played in a NY6 bowl in 2015, and then played in another NY6 game (and won) in 2016. His average top 25 finish the past 5 seasons has been #8.

Yes, I know he has had a bad year this year, but he has built one of the truly elite programs in Tallahassee. Why would he leave all that to go to a program that has not been truly elite in decades?

Not only that, did you see his buy-out? $39 million...would gaggy pay that much?

 

[Purp]

Just playing devil's advocate here, but I think some of our fans need some humbling.

We laugh at A&M for being an inferior football program to us and laugh that they think Patterson would ever consider joining that dumpster fire... but what exactly makes us a better football program? The only answer is Gary Patterson.

As much as I hate Aggy, I'm not too blindly arrogant to admit that they have more resources than we do, more fans than we do, MUCH better fan support than we do, facilities that are just as good or better than we do, and are in a conference that is nationally perceived as the best conference in the land. Not to mention they already out recruit us regularly with Sumlin.

It's not illogical to think that Patterson would consider jumping ship, especially if he feels as if he's in the twilight years of his career and if he feels as if his chances at winning it at all are simply too improbable at TCU.

Ego could very much be at play. Maybe Patterson is tired of our fickle fan base. Maybe Patterson is tired of losing recruiting battles to programs that continue to under perform his program. Maybe he thinks he's a better coach than Nick Saban and thinks, "Hell. Give me access to the resources and recruits that he gets, I can compete for National Championships every year too... and I can beat him"

I don't think Patterson leaves, but I don't think it's as ludacris as some of you make it out to seem. As Frog9497 said, never underestimate ego.

First of all, what does Luda have to do with any of this? Are you saying GP has hoes in the 979?

Next, you need to relax again. A percoset, two vicodin, and a couple beers will do you some good. Our program is better than aTm for a lot of reason, but the biggest reason that they can't replicate is that GP has very little pressure here and has carte blanche to do things his way all the time. Add to that the fact that fewer major benefactors results in fewer people meddling in your job and how you do things and there's no comparing the two posts.

Sure, resources like you describe may be appealing to him, but I don't think the resource gap is very large at all and not nearly as large as you seem to think. The fact of the matter is that all the resources in the world won't make aTm a better job than TCU for CGP or anybody else b/c there is far more bureaucracy in the Station and CGP hates playing that game more than he hates a few empty seats in the stadium.

 

[tcumaniac]

Patterson doesn't want job securirty. He wants a national championship.

Yes. Patterson would much rather win a National Championship at TCU. He would much rather finalize his legacy at the schoold that he brought out of the wilderness and turned into a National Champion. These things play into our favor.

Patterson has arguably had 3 National Championship quality teams and hasn't even been given the chance to prove it... and one of those teams was while in the Big 12.

I love TCU and our community, but let's not be naive. Patterson loses recruiting battles on a regular basis to kids that would rather go play in a stadium that packs the house with over 100,000 rabid fans game after game. He loses recruits to schools that he outperforms year after year, and I'm sure it's exhausting.

I loved his recent quote that said he didn't want the kids that picked a school because of their big stadium, but in the back of his head he's got to be thinking that his life would be a lot easier if he could more regularly land the 4 and 5 star recruits. He'd be able to do that at A&M. Hell, Sumlin is a terrible coach and he's already doing it. Hard to imagine Patterson wouldn't be somewhat tempted to have access to better recruiting classes.

Again, I don't think he leaves TCU. But let's not take him for granted and assume there's no reason he would ever at least consider going to Aggy.

 

[Jefffrog1993]

Coach P is the best ever period. Having said that our AD and admin has spent the money made all investments requested by Coach P including paying the assistant coaches top salaries. Our fans and alumni are great too. We are not perfect, but you have to have everyone on the same page and TCU does!

 

[Purp]

I love TCU and our community, but let's not be naive. Patterson loses recruiting battles on a regular basis to kids that would rather go play in a stadium that packs the house with over 100,000 rabid fans game after game. He loses recruits to schools that he outperforms year after year, and I'm sure it's exhausting.

I think he also knows he loses recruiting battles to aTm b/c they have people he can't control greasing palms that shouldn't be greased. Maybe he doesn't want to be a part of those shenanigans.

I think he also loses recruits to other programs because he is who he is and he isn't going to change that for anybody. You've said yourself that kids who don't want to work to get better don't come to TCU b/c they think they can still get to the NFL taking the path of least resistance at some other big state school. If CGP were at aTm he wouldn't suddenly allow talented players to get away with rule breaking b/c they are top blue chip recruits. He won't change for anybody, which is what's made him successful.

There's way more to it than losing recruiting battles and empty seats in the lower bowl. You're over-simplifying the comparison and not giving CGP enough credit for knowing what he has in Fort Worth.

 

[Wexahu]

Patterson doesn't want job securirty. He wants a national championship.

Yes. Patterson would much rather win a National Championship at TCU. He would much rather finalize his legacy at the schoold that he brought out of the wilderness and turned into a National Champion. These things play into our favor.

Patterson has arguably had 3 National Championship quality teams and hasn't even been given the chance to prove it... and one of those teams was while in the Big 12.

I love TCU and our community, but let's not be naive. Patterson loses recruiting battles on a regular basis to kids that would rather go play in a stadium that packs the house with over 100,000 rabid fans game after game. He loses recruits to schools that he outperforms year after year, and I'm sure it's exhausting.

I loved his recent quote that said he didn't want the kids that picked a school because of their big stadium, but in the back of his head he's got to be thinking that his life would be a lot easier if he could more regularly land the 4 and 5 star recruits. He'd be able to do that at A&M. Hell, Sumlin is a terrible coach and he's already doing it. Hard to imagine Patterson wouldn't be somewhat tempted to have access to better recruiting classes.

Again, I don't think he leaves TCU. But let's not take him for granted and assume there's no reason he would ever at least consider going to Aggy.

I don't see how you can watch the Aggies and the Frogs play and believe they have better players (or recruits in other words) than we do. So are we really losing recruiting battles as much as you think we are?

Our overall talent level keeps getting better and deeper every year. Next year the talent we have on the defensive side of the ball will be far superior to what the Aggies throw out there, I can almost guarantee that. Plus, I think the backup QB we have now and the one we have coming in next year the Aggies would love to have. So what gives?

 

[CountryFrog]

I don't understand the people who think more fans = better fan support.

I do agree with Maniac on the sentiment that we need to make sure we never take GP for granted. I'm not worried about him leaving but we should absolutely love him as if we were worried about him leaving. Not just to keep him here, but because he's earned it.

I heart GP.

 

[cheese83]

Yes, there's ego involved as well as a monster slice of competitive nature plus the desire to be a part of The Game on a big stage. Another appeal may be the chance to start again with a clean slate.

The thing with taking such a job as A&M is that, in addition to the kids and wreckage left by the previous coach, you get the horde of sullen alumni that are ready to kick you to the curb in favor of the next New Coach because you aren't winning enough. Everybody wants Saban, but there's only one of him, and even he's not a sure thing.

What's funny is that Saban is 66. He's a complete creature of the game and will not simply retire: He loves it too much. But, in 4-5 years, he might just have to hang up his whistle. Whoever replaces him at Alabama may be good, but he won't be Saban. The feeding frenzy and deep craziness that will attempt to fill that void will be amusing to watch from a safe distance...

The guys who always follow a legend tend to fail miserably. Bama will end up struggling for a few years after he leaves. What he is doing is unheard of, but he’s also single handedly rebuilt the SEC West w his time at LSU and Bama.

 

[Fred Garvin]

Chad Morris would be a great fit for the Raiders.

He can (and will) do much better.

 

[MinerFrog2409]

I don't see how you can watch the Aggies and the Frogs play and believe they have better players (or recruits in other words) than we do. So are we really losing recruiting battles as much as you think we are?

Our overall talent level keeps getting better and deeper every year. Next year the talent we have on the defensive side of the ball will be far superior to what the Aggies throw out there, I can almost guarantee that. Plus, I think the backup QB we have now and the one we have coming in next year the Aggies would love to have. So what gives?

I agree with you wholeheartedly. We have gotten much better recruiting classes in the last 5 years and will continue to improve our rank. But CGP doesn't care about stars anyways. He gets guys who fit his system and aren't a bunch of prima donnas.

 

[Pharm Frog]

A percoset, two vicodin, and a couple beers will do you some good.

Would not recommend this tonic.

 

[froginaustin]

Welp,
Is Sumlin officially out yet, or not?

 

[Dogfrog]

Patterson doesn't want job securirty. He wants a national championship.

Yes. Patterson would much rather win a National Championship at TCU. He would much rather finalize his legacy at the schoold that he brought out of the wilderness and turned into a National Champion. These things play into our favor.

Patterson has arguably had 3 National Championship quality teams and hasn't even been given the chance to prove it... and one of those teams was while in the Big 12.

I love TCU and our community, but let's not be naive. Patterson loses recruiting battles on a regular basis to kids that would rather go play in a stadium that packs the house with over 100,000 rabid fans game after game. He loses recruits to schools that he outperforms year after year, and I'm sure it's exhausting.

I loved his recent quote that said he didn't want the kids that picked a school because of their big stadium, but in the back of his head he's got to be thinking that his life would be a lot easier if he could more regularly land the 4 and 5 star recruits. He'd be able to do that at A&M. Hell, Sumlin is a terrible coach and he's already doing it. Hard to imagine Patterson wouldn't be somewhat tempted to have access to better recruiting classes.

Again, I don't think he leaves TCU. But let's not take him for granted and assume there's no reason he would ever at least consider going to Aggy.

The problem with this is for GP to drop TCU because he thinks he can get a NC at A&M would be admitting he cant get it done at TCU. He may be well on his way this year. If not, GP, his coaches, and his recruits didnt get it done at ISU. He has nobody to blame but himself for that. Not the committee or the conference, his fans or the lower bowl. I can't believe GP has the loser mentality you describe here.

Edit: only reason I would see him doing it is a money grab which I think is unlikely.

 

[Bob Sugar]

I agree with you wholeheartedly. We have gotten much better recruiting classes in the last 5 years and will continue to improve our rank. But CGP doesn't care about stars anyways. He gets guys who fit his system and aren't a bunch of prima donnas.

This statement is why I am not worried about GP leaving TCU. He knows that it will be incredibly difficult to install the 4-2-5 on 11 starters who played in a different system the last few years. I doubt he wants to go through the growing pains of coaching up a bunch of new players and convincing them to buy into his system.

 

[2314]

Are you saying GP has hoes in the 979?

Seriously, [ What the heck? ] does that mean? Is this teeny-bopper language, or what?

 

[Chico Dusty]

Seriously, [ What the heck? ] does that mean? Is this teeny-bopper language, or what?

It was a reference to a ludacris song that was brought up after maniac spelled the word wrong - the song is about having hoes in different area codes.

 

[HeidelFrog]

Point taken. I have learned, however, to never underestimate ego. I’m not necessarily applying this to CGP, but it seems like there are a number of coaches out there who coach not for the money but for ego. These guys are driven in pursuit of proving their ability to win, and to win it all. I sometimes wonder why a guy like Saban isn’t bored by now. I’m sure he’s already set for life financially. So what brings him back? Urban Meyer couldn’t stay away (tho his health issue may be made up). Les Miles can’t wait to get back into coaching from what I’ve read. He probably doesn’t need the work. So I guess there’s a small part of me that worries that CGP will think he has better access to building his dream team there and in a relatively short period of time. But I don’t know that the path to a NC is any easier... probably harder notwithstanding.

Could it possibly be they just love to coach? Unlike Lane Kiffin maybe they believe in loyalty?

 

[Fred Garvin]

Seriously, [ What the heck? ] does that mean? Is this teeny-bopper language, or what?

Relax grandpa.

 

[Boomhauer]

I don't see CGP leaving and especially not for an SEC job. He has an easier path to the playoffs via Big 12 right now than trying to take down Saban in his prime for the SEC bid.