1. The KillerFrogs

Wilder-Fury II

Discussion in 'Scott & Wes Frog Fan Forum' started by FBallFan123, Feb 19, 2020.

  1. Then why have weight classes at all?

    Might as well have an open weight class and let whomever fight whomever like the original UFC.
  2. Good idea if you want to kill the sport. The lighter classes are their so that you can capitalize on good fighters that aren't huge men, and still make boatloads of cash selling their fights (see Floyd Mayweather).
    Showtime Joe 2.0 likes this.
  3. I get why they are there, as they need to be. That’s the point of my post. I see no reason why you couldn’t add a superheavy weight class and still capitalize on the bigger fighters. If fighters want to move up and down between the divisions, then so be it. Make the weight.

    40lbs is a massive advantage when leaning on another fighter. You(in general) won’t lose anything as a fan seeing two 230lb buys box vs two 270lb fighters box.
  4. #64 FBallFan123, Feb 23, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2020
    Most people after the weigh-in were saying Fury was too heavy and the added weight would hurt him, not help him.

    Many also dismissed the significance of Fury changing trainers and styles and saying he was going for the knockout.

    So let’s give some credit to just how unique a talent Tyson Fury is to do what he did at 6’9, 270+ pounds.

    As for changing the the weight limits ... fans, money and boxers will always gravitate towards the biggest weight class.

    The best cruiserweights almost always end up moving up to heavyweight ...because that’s where the fame and money is.

    If you raise the cruiserweight limit, or create a “super heavyweight” division, you’ll have the same thing with boxers moving up.
    Showtime Joe 2.0 likes this.
  5. #65 FBallFan123, Feb 23, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2020
    Deontay Wilder just got a reported $28 million guaranteed.

    Think he’d be satisfied fighting smaller guys for less money?

    Look at a boxer like Evander Holyfield: he was a cruiserweight champion and nobody even talks about what he did at that weight.

    He was often a lot smaller in many of his big heavyweight fights: Buster Douglas, George Foreman, Larry Holmes, Riddick Bowe, Lennox Lewis.

    Mike Tyson was one guy sorta similarly sized to Holyfield.

    Some of the other heavyweights who were similarly sized had moved up in weight just like he did...

    Michael Moorer was light heavyweight champion.

    John Ruiz began his career at cruiserweight.

    Chris Byrd fought in the Olympics as middleweight.

    James Toney was a middleweight champion before he started climbing divisions (collecting titles at super middleweight and cruiserweight).

    Point being...guys go where the money is.
    Showtime Joe 2.0 likes this.
  6. #69 FBallFan123, Feb 23, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2020
    Yep. Fury is an incredible personality and showman for boxing.

    He brings a McGregor/Mayweather type presence to the division.

    The division feels revitalized.

    Deontay Wilder-Anthony Joshua was building towards a big fight ... but the division may have gotten a bit stale waiting for it.

    They were mostly fighting on different sides of the Atlantic, different promoters, different networks ... with no obvious bridge between.

    Fury’s performance in the first Wilder fight led to the Top Rank contract which brought ESPN into the mix and helped build up the rematch.

    Top Rank has since gone on a heavyweight signing spree ... ESPN is now heavily invested in the heavyweight division.

    Fury’s win last night sets him up now as the #1 in the division.

    I think that is a better situation for making fights compared to when Wilder and Joshua were both thinking they're #1.

    Plus, PBC/FOX and Top Rank/ESPN worked so well together that maybe they now have a blueprint for other big fights down the line.
    Showtime Joe 2.0 likes this.
  7. Yah I bet guys like Mayweather, Pacquiao, Alvarez, etc didn’t make any money.
  8. Not sure how anyone thought Wilder would/could win. In his own words he landed his best punch on Fury last time around and Fury got right back up. #Legend
    MTfrog5 and Showtime Joe 2.0 like this.
  9. True. I just think there is a point where the weight advantage has diminishing returns. Maybe its above 225 or 250 instead of 200. Who knows? I'll say one thing, though. Growing up in the Mike Tyson era, he'd knock the [ Cumbie’s red zone playcalling ] outta anyone. I dont care how much they weighed.
    Purp and netty2424 like this.
  10. One of the main reasons that those boxers you mention made so much money is that the heavyweight division was moribund when they were in their prime. When the heavyweight division is riding high and attracting interest, it naturally sucks the oxygen out of the lower divisions. People like to see big guys fight each other if only because the potential for actual knockouts is greater than it is with smaller fighters.
    netty2424 likes this.
  11. Fury is a freak of nature. He's 6'9''and 270 with punching power, boxing skills, ring savvy, and guts. And he can take a punch too. He's truly a generational figure in the sport.
    Bonner4Prez, MTfrog5 and Chongo94 like this.
  12. Loved watching Tyson fight. It was a major event for my buddies. As was everyone else, we were all speechless when Buster Douglas knocked him out.

    There are some videos on social media of Tyson throwing hands recently and he’s still scary.
    Shorty and Double V like this.
  13. He was so outta shape and outta practice for that Buster Douglas fight, it was sad. I remember thinking he must have been getting paid to throw it, the way he just stood there and took punch after punch. He was a MASTER at not letting his opponents land anything square, but BD was just destroying him. It was crazy.
    netty2424 likes this.
  14. #77 FBallFan123, Feb 23, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2020
    Those boxers had many of their biggest fights in the 147-160 range ... as welterweight (147) and middleweight (160) have long been money divisions ... and super welterweight/light middleweight (154), which developed into a money division.

    The divisions from super middleweight (168) to cruiserweight (200) do not tend to be big money divisions.

    Cruiserweight has never been a money division compared to heavyweight.

    Take a generational talent like Roy Jones Jr.

    Champion at middleweight, super middleweight and light heavyweight.

    He bypassed cruiserweight to move up to heavyweight ... and his fight against John Ruiz for the heavyweight title got him his career-high payday.

    There was talk even bigger money fights against guys like Lennox Lewis or Mike Tyson ... but they never happened.

    Canelo is a big enough star that he will bring some money fights to that 168+ divisions ... but he is a rare box office talent, and one who was built in big fights in the lower divisions.
    Showtime Joe 2.0 and netty2424 like this.
  15. There were a lot of things that surprised me last week about people's opinions of this fight.

    Like how many people picked Wilder in the ESPN poll.

    And after the weigh-in, a lot of people were saying well Fury's too heavy, he doesn't look in shape...the added weight will hurt him … saw a number of comparisons to Andy Ruiz before the Anthony Joshua rematch.

    I watched the weigh-in and thought the opposite....that Fury looked good, looked strong and that the added weight could help him, just as he'd been saying.

    Teddy Atlas is wrong about a lot of things, so I ignore a lot of what he says - including the twitter post below - but I post it here because I saw a number of people who had similar opinions after the weigh-in...

    And on fight night I see people commenting that Fury looks too loose and relaxed in his dressing room...

    It's amazing how many people were completely wrong about this fight.

    Reminds me of the first Holyfield-Tyson fight when Ron Borges was the only media member who took Holyfield in the press poll.

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