• The KillerFrogs

TCU Getting a Med School

Deep Purple

Full Member
TCUdirtbag said:
I don't think TCU College of Medicine at UNTHSC is off the table on logistical grounds as it's hard to see how the majority of the classes won't be at UNTHSC as they'll already have cadaver labs etc. that wouldn't make sense to duplicate on TCU's campus.
 
I attended the presser today with the head of TCU's Pre-Health Institute and an assistant dean in the College of Science & Engineering (where the Pre-Health Institute is located).  Both told me that the final name -- whatever it is -- won't include "at __" because the division of classes will be at both institutions.
 

Deep Purple

Full Member
Frogcrates said:
I'm calling it right now... The Moncrief School of Medicine
 
Don't bet on it.  Moncrief is a huge private backer of UT-Southwest Medical School & Center in Dallas.  No way he'd lend his name to a rival program in Fort Worth.
 

Frogcrates

Active Member
Deep Purple said:
 
Don't bet on it.  Moncrief is a huge private backer of UT-Southwest Medical School & Center in Dallas.  No way he'd lend his name to a rival program in Fort Worth.
Tongue in cheek.
 

TCUdirtbag

Active Member
Deep Purple said:
I attended the presser today with the head of TCU's Pre-Health Institute and an assistant dean in the College of Science & Engineering (where the Pre-Health Institute is located).  Both told me that the final name -- whatever it is -- won't include "at __" because the division of classes will be at both institutions.
 
Unless it's "at TCU and UNTHSC." E.g., ____ College of Med at TCU and UNTHSC.  
 
Like I said, it's July 2015 and applications won't be available for just over 2 years and the first students don't roll in for 3 years. We're probably a year away from a name. On the business side of starting it up, there's lots to be figured out and lots of moving parts. They have a MOU, but very few details are set in stone. Will be fun to watch develop. There will certainly be some surprises and changes along the way.
 
To me, one of the most interesting thing to watch will be whether the legislature gives UNTHSC the ability to confer M.D. degrees in the 2017 session, if they wait until the school is open and look at it in 2019, or if they just never give it to them.  Such a bizarre law, but one that kind of works in TCU's favor in the event leadership changes after the opening and the Boards get at odds on something. 
 
Unrelated: this is a huge endeavor, and it sure seems like it may lock Boschini in Fort Worth for quite some time (not that he was looking, but I'm sure he wants to see this through--all his kids are at or through TCU now, I think, so he was getting close to a natural possible exit point). 
 
Deep, I'm assuming foundations will be a big target in this one. Do try to not be condescending. I recommend non-written communication. 
 

YA

Active Member
One thing to keep in mind is JPS is about to build more medical facilities, specifically beds and clinics. More opportunities for additional residency slots for the new medical school.
 

Hoosierfrog

Tier 1
YA said:
Sure it is. If you don't like getting old then you could off yourself. If not, quit complaining you are old.

Many times you have complained that Obamacare is socialized medicine. It isn't but the one socialized medicine in America is Medicare. I assume you being the anti-socialist you are one would assume one would not participate in such a event. I see the complaints from you are just so other people cannot have medical care, but you have no problem having other people pay for your care. And btw, no one in America has paid enough into Medicare to cover the average costs that each individual Medicare enrollee receives over the course of their life.

My plan for retirement is to do so by 55. I'm on track to do so and I would not live in the cesspool known as Indiana. I let you know how it goes.
Another well reasoned argument counselor. Just off myself? Man, who pissed you off? Are you always such a pleasant person? Not sure why you are going full attack mode. Did I ever complain about being old or even use the word socialized medicine?
 
If you can arrange for me to get the money back I paid into Medicare, please do and I can afford to make do.

As for accepting benefits others provided? You mean like being a proud Texan and living in a state built on conservative ideas like low taxes, booming economy, jobs Surely you won't retire early in Texas and enjoy the economy built on cosevative principles or enjoy the low taxes a conservative government provides for you.
 
Have you spent a lot years living in the Indiana cesspool? It may not be Eden, but it has good and bad points. Otherwise you just sound like a little kid lashing out at something you know nothing about. It sounds to me ike you might not be so bitter if you lived in California, Massachusetts or Greece where the fruits of your beliefs are reaping so many benefits.

Maybe Colorado is for you, a little ganja might help you mellow out...
 
 
 
 
 
 

TCUSA

Full Member
OICU812 said:
Which as a patient will no doubt feel wildly different than your doc being a bureaucrat protecting the insurance industry first, looking out for his own interest second, and if coincidentally you get properly treated at the same time, well hey, [Craig James] happens.
You're friggin stupid if you think you've got anything different--only now it's government approved and government protected.
 

Hoosierfrog

Tier 1
GeorgeLanescaddy said:
Thanks baby boomers and yet they try to lecture our age group of our financial decisions.
Yes, we intentionally set out to do this to you. I personally lobbied LBJ when I was in Junior High...

That's the problem with entitlements, like Margaret Thatcher said, "sooner or later you run out of other people's money."

You act like certain generations are responsible for this. People just live under the systems they are given. Blame your politicians that set up unworkable entitlements. I'm sure someone will be blaming whatever generation you belong to for something. Or maybe you can be like the Greeks cheering in the streets and not having a clue what they just did to themselves or how they put themselves in this position.

Governments should govern and not baby sit. I believe the document says something to the effect of our inalienable rights are life, liberty and the 'pursuit' of happiness. Nowhere does it say it will be 'provided' to you.
 

tcudoc

Full Member
Genus Rana said:
Any news on what residencies will be associated with the school? And when those will begin?
They could form an academic partnership with existing residency programs, such as the ones at JPS.  Or, it is not unprecedented to have a clinical campus in another city, say...one that already has ~450 residents in a well established GME program.  That is what Texas A&M did when they started their medical school in the 70's.  Perhaps if the University of North Texas thing falls apart, a partnership like that could evolve with a large hospital that has a long tradition of training medical students and residents.  You just never know.
 

rifram09

Active Member
For the docs: is there something TCU and/or wealthy TCU supporters should do to help generate residency positions in FW? For example, could a wealthy donor gift a large sum to an existing hospital in FW to create new residency slots? Is that how it typically works? If not, how does it usually work.

Thanks!
 

tcudoc

Full Member
McFroggin said:
Residency possibilities depend more on the hospitals than the med school. It is possible that our academic affiliation leads a hospital to add residency options but I think that is far out.
...and groovy.
breadinthosethreads500.JPG
 

tcudoc

Full Member
Rifram09 said:
For the docs: is there something TCU and/or wealthy TCU supporters should do to help generate residency positions in FW? For example, could a wealthy donor gift a large sum to an existing hospital in FW to create new residency slots? Is that how it typically works? If not, how does it usually work.

Thanks!
Residency, or GME, positions are typically funded by government dollars through medicare.  A cap on funded positions was put in place in the mid to late 90's, so that the number of positions each program had funded was frozen at the cap.  Because some teaching hospitals utilize residents heavily, many went over the cap by funding the positions themselves out of operational dollars.  The deciding factor tends to be figuring out if they could get NP's or PA's or staff physicians to do the work normally done by residents at a comparable price.  Many factors go into this decision since there are built in inefficiencies when you deal with residents in training.  The natural course is that they do their training and move on, so the hospital is constantly dealing with new and inexperienced young doctors.  The new ones tend to order more unnecessary tests and those costs are bore by the hospital (and patients?).  A certain part of the direct and indirect costs paid by the medicare money that funds those training positions are earmarked for the hospital to cover some of those inefficiencies. 
When hospitals go over their medicare caps, they must bear all of the hidden costs themselves, so determining the value versus costs of residency training in those situations has been an ongoing study and it varies greatly by specialty.  Residents get paid very little if you look at it on a per hour basis, since many work 80 hours a week.  Replacing one resident, in certain situations, may require hiring two persons (NP's, PA's, CRNA's etc).  However, because residents rotate on other specialties/services/hospitals that the other providers do not, the ratio and costs can be very challenging to figure, and is often just a best guess.  I mentioned that new residents can be very inefficient, however, residents who are in a 4 or 5 year program are generally excellent by the time they are in the 3rd through 5th year, and often even in their 2nd year.  So, those residents provide outstanding resources for patient care at very little cost.  Other things such as benefits have to be factored in for each group. 
Funding a mid size or large residency program can be very costly.  Getting government funding for a new residency program is likely challenging.  Funding it completely from the private sector would be a high cost as well.  Another monetary source is the VA.  Many med schools and residency programs collaborate with a VA hospital in order to defray some of the costs, since the VA will fund a percentage of the residency programs in exchange for the services of the residents in the care of their veterans.  Other examples include collaborations with other hospitals.  For example, UTMB Galveston collaborates with the Texas Dept of Corrections as well as the Shriner's Burn Hospital.
It has recently been estimated that each resident (in our area of the country; salaries are generally higher in CA and NY, for instance) has an annual cost of ~$75K after salary and benefits have been factored in.  So, for a private entity to fund a residency program of modest size, say 50 residents per year, it would require an annual contribution of $3.75 million.  Assume that the teaching hospital or VA partner would pay a large portion of that for clinical services covered.  So, I am not sure what costs would be left over that would require funding.  The funding would have to be renewable for the health of the residency programs with their accreditation bodies.  In addition, they would need to make sure willing faculty are in place to teach the residents (the experience a trainee gets in a large teaching hospital will be vastly different than the experience they receive in a small community hospital).
I have written all of this to say, I really don't know how much it would take in funding to make it worth it to a hospital to undertake this type of endeavor if they had not previously been doing that. 
 
 
Bring on the TL/DR
 

McFroggin

Active Member
Rifram09 said:
For the docs: is there something TCU and/or wealthy TCU supporters should do to help generate residency positions in FW? For example, could a wealthy donor gift a large sum to an existing hospital in FW to create new residency slots? Is that how it typically works? If not, how does it usually work.

Thanks!
While I have never started a residency program, the funding is federal. You need ACGME approval, specialty board approval, and a facility that has the required staff, rotations, rules in place. Residencies have more to do with the hospitals/treatment centers than the medical school.
 

tcudoc

Full Member
McFroggin said:
While I have never started a residency program, the funding is federal. You need ACGME approval, specialty board approval, and a facility that has the required staff, rotations, rules in place. Residencies have more to do with the hospitals/treatment centers than the medical school.
^^  This.  Although, most residency programs will form academic partnerships with medical schools and collaborate on the training.  Having a learning environment in a teaching hospital is one of the most common ways of training med students.  Residents are often excellent teachers and have a lot to contribute to the medical student's education during their clinical rotations.  Some medical schools have their own teaching hospitals while others collaborate with teaching hospitals.
 

rifram09

Active Member
Thanks for taking the time to give the uninitiated a crash course! Interesting stuff. I'm excited to see how TCU meets these challenges.
 
Considering the Bass family's prominent position in the Fort Worth community....it is difficult to imagine
 
them not playing some major role in something this significant.
 

Deep Purple

Full Member
TCUdirtbag said:
Unless it's "at TCU and UNTHSC." E.g., ____ College of Med at TCU and UNTHSC.   
 
I suppose that would work -- if we wanted a cumbersome name that nobody will remember or use.
 
Deep, I'm assuming foundations will be a big target in this one. Do try to not be condescending. I recommend non-written communication.
 
Thanks for your advice.  I've been so lost and unsuccessful for the past 21 years without it.
 
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