• The KillerFrogs

No-huddle uptempo offense

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Wexahu

Full Member
Just wondering if anyone here thinks all of these uptempo, hurry-up offenses you see have kind of run their course and no longer provide any sort of advantage. Personally I think they maybe have and where it used to be a way for undermanned teams to change things up and give a better team a different look they aren't used to, nowadays everyone is prepared for them. The result now IMO is it just lengthens games and increases the # of possessions, which usually always favors the better team. Basically, it plays right into the hands of the very best teams because you now basically have to beat them at their own game for more possessions.

I know almost nobody actually huddles anymore (I'm not sure why though, if you're not going to hurry to get a play off, go ahead and huddle), but I'm talking the incessant need for almost every team to be enamored with "going fast". Is it just for the recruiting pitch now? I see teams like Iowa State and Kansas State that just seem to frustrate the heck out of teams by just taking their time, executing the little stuff, and burning the clock down thus shortening the game.....and wonder if that might be the better way to go. In my opinion, all the advantages to your offense that running hurry up gives you is offset by what it does to your defense.
 
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M

Moose Stuff

Active Member
Sure would seem to suit GP type football. If I thought we were capable of what ISU did to WV or what KSU did to OSU in the second half I’d be all in.
 
W

Wexahu

Full Member
MrMcgibblets said:
We don’t go fast except for the 1st drive.
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For the most part you're right. I'm not necessarily talking about just our team though, but in general. The main advantage of going fast is you line up and go before the defense is ready. Well, defenses have adjusted and they are almost always ready now so that advantage is largely gone. Which begs the question, if you aren't going to go fast, why not huddle? I guess you might say you want to see where the defense is lining up and call a play accordingly. But when the defense sees how the offense is lining up, can't they do the same thing? I know a major part of GPs success is film study and knowing what the other team is going to run based on how they line up, and then making a pre-snap call. If they break a huddle and run out to their positions without tipping it off does a defensive coach even have time to call a play? Who has the advantage of seeing what the other team might do....the offense or the defense?

I could just see an offense breaking the huddle and running out to their positions and snapping the ball on a fairly quick count while the defenders are all looking toward the sideline waiting for a signal from their DC.
 
S

Sebastian S

Active Member
I would LOVE if they could get into a huddle.

Just for the simple fact of getting everybody on the same damn page.

This no huddle is confusing OUR players and not the opposing defense.
 
Eight

Eight

Member
frogs are in an akward transition offensively.

patterson is not in favor on the no huddle, hurry ups that have his defense back on the field in a short amount of time.

the offense right now doesn't have the line to control tempo by pounding the run game such as iowa state or texas

tempo can be used to simplify the reads for a quarterback who is struggling but that isn't going to happen at the start of games which are scripted.

this offense has been plagued by mistakes across that side of the ball and it isn't simply robinson and turnovers. penalties, missed chances in the passing game, poor play design, missed blocks, plus turnovers has killed chances in the 3 losses.

there are not simple answers and i am not sure how much can be fixed in season. my biggest concern is that all the problems can't be fixed due to staff loyalty and the decision to run an offense that doesn't come from the oc's background.

it doens't mean sonny can't adjust, but who does he lean on in the offensive staff to build an offense?
 
MadFrog

MadFrog

Active Member
We don't huddle up. We just stand around looking at the sideline and then the center finally will center the ball at least 1 count after the clap of hands. Around 5 seconds left on the clock. To me a harry up centers the ball at least 10 seconds left on the clock. We do not have a hurry up offense any more.
 
W

Wexahu

Full Member
netty2424 said:
If it’s run it’s course, it’s not because it isn’t effective, it’s because the NCAA has decided they don’t like it and have instructed their officials to slow it down. Sitting on the ball allowing the defense to sub is ridiculous to me.

I still don’t understand this.
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It's frustrating but it almost has to be done IMO. Otherwise, the defense would be forced to not substitute (while the offense freely does) or be exposed to a never ending sequence of too-many-guys-on-the-field penalties. The refs won't sit on the ball if the offense doesn't sub players in and out. So if the offense is tired of it, just don't substitute.
 
S

Sebastian S

Active Member
And the offense has to give ample time for the defense to sub as well.

If the offense subs with 10 seconds left, the defense can sub as well, does the offense get a delay of game?
 
W

Wexahu

Full Member
Sebastian S said:
And the offense has to give ample time for the defense to sub as well.

If the offense subs with 10 seconds left, the defense can sub as well, does the offense get a delay of game?
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Yes, they should. All substitutions by the offense should have to take place with at least 25-30 seconds left on the play clock ideally. Don't know what the rules are, but the refs should have authority to penalize either team that they think is trying to work the system unfairly.
 
netty2424

netty2424

Full Member
Wexahu said:
It's frustrating but it almost has to be done IMO. Otherwise, the defense would be forced to not substitute (while the offense freely does) or be exposed to a never ending sequence of too-many-guys-on-the-field penalties. The refs won't sit on the ball if the offense doesn't sub players in and out. So if the offense is tired of it, just don't substitute.
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Maybe we should protest their offensive line outweighing our defensive line by 30lbs per person(or whatever the number is).

That’s an advantage, no?
 
Eight

Eight

Member
you can still run the nhuh, but that means you can not do the things the frogs do such as constantly subbing receivers in and out.

the bigger issue to me is the standing over the ball for such a period of time in a static formation. supposedly it is done to help identify match-ups, but as pointed out the defense is not forced to really show much.

motion, shifts, different formations have a purpose and i think we are starting to see it make a comeback in some offenses.

unfortunately a good portion of college football has gotten where college basketball has gone and that is the coaches on the sidelines trying to control every play instead of working within the flow of the game
 
W

Wexahu

Full Member
Eight said:
you can still run the nhuh, but that means you can not do the things the frogs do such as constantly subbing receivers in and out.

the bigger issue to me is the standing over the ball for such a period of time in a static formation. supposedly it is done to help identify match-ups, but as pointed out the defense is not forced to really show much.

motion, shifts, different formations have a purpose and i think we are starting to see it make a comeback in some offenses.

unfortunately a good portion of college football has gotten where college basketball has gone and that is the coaches on the sidelines trying to control every play instead of working within the flow of the game
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Good post. I imagine GP loves it when an offense stays static for a long time looking over to the sideline for signals. That's right in his wheelhouse, makes all the film study worthwhile. I'm sure other defensive coaches would say the same thing. And I bet they'd hate it if offenses went into a huddle, quickly ran out to their positions after breaking the huddle, and the QB snapped the ball in a relatively short amount of time. Which begs the questions, if the defense would hate, why doesn't the offense do it?
 
Eight

Eight

Member
Wexahu said:
Good post. I imagine GP loves it when an offense stays static for a long time looking over to the sideline for signals. That's right in his wheelhouse, makes all the film study worthwhile. I'm sure other defensive coaches would say the same thing. And I bet they'd hate it if offenses went into a huddle, quickly ran out to their positions after breaking the huddle, and the QB snapped the ball in a relatively short amount of time. Which begs the questions, if the defense would hate, why doesn't the offense do it?
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the only consistent explanation i have gotten from friends who coach is they are looking for the best match-up which sounds good, but if you struggle to execute things i just think it makes things more difficult in so many ways
 
TxFrog1999

TxFrog1999

The Man Behind The Curtain
I measure our up-tempo offense by how fast I have to type to do PBP in the gameday thread. In 2014 I had to often include multiple plays in one post due to the speed at which we were snapping the ball. Since 2014 (and most of 2015) I've been able to type the PBP at a much more leisurely pace.
 
satis1103

satis1103

DAOTONPYH EHT LIAH LLA
No huddle worked well for us when we had experienced guys with a lot of knowledge and time in the offense. Confusion reigns when it is a relatively new squad.

Tangential note, I said it during game thread but I believe that defenses are improving versus the read option and I wonder if its delay in movement/direction may now be doing more harm than good.
 

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