General Bowl Games Conversation

[FinanceFrog]

I like Baylor's program right now.

 

[FinanceFrog]

it’s amazing how bad the cfp games have been throughout the years.

 

[Hoosierfrog]

I’m not sure what your point is. The two best teams made the championship game. They probably will continue to do so. I find it boring and most likely won’t watch attentively or at all. I’ve read this book already and know how it ends.

woo hoo, we get to watch another SEC conference game…

 

[Wexahu]

I have zero interest in the national championship game. None. I’ve already watched that game.

What's the solution? Maybe there isn't one.

Everyone seems to think we need more teams in the playoffs so they are more "inclusive" but that would result in more rematches than ever (like the NFL), and I guess you have no interest in watching teams that have already played each other. Maybe they could just pick different teams every year regardless of how well they do during the season just so we have new blood in the playoffs.

Just tuned into ESPN and Herbstreit and the rest of the panel were discussing the issues of college football and how games don't seem to matter anymore (four OSU starters sitting out the Rose Bowl). They didn't have any answers either but they clearly realize the sport pretty much sucks now, even though they are getting paid a crap ton of money to cover it.

 

[Wexahu]

it’s amazing how bad the cfp games have been throughout the years.

There is very little parity in college football. The playoffs have just hammered that point home and made it totally obvious. Playoff expansion would just hammer it home even more. Used to be a team could win a freaking national title without even having to play one of the best teams, much less beat them. No longer. Gonna be the same handful of teams every single year in the final game with very, very few exceptions.

I don't think there is a solution barring MAJOR changes to how players are acquired.

 

[froginmn]

There is very little parity in college football.

I don't think there is a solution barring MAJOR changes to how players are acquired.

Like, say, the transfer portal and NIL money?

Jeff Bezos could pick the school he wants to win (I'd like him to pick his brother's college) and pay to make it happen.

 

[Hoosierfrog]

There is very little parity in college football. The playoffs have just hammered that point home and made it totally obvious. Playoff expansion would just hammer it home even more. Used to be a team could win a freaking national title without even having to play one of the best teams, much less beat them. No longer. Gonna be the same handful of teams every single year in the final game with very, very few exceptions.

I don't think there is a solution barring MAJOR changes to how players are acquired.

There may be no solution. I thought the CFP would be a good thing, but I think it was much fun when the bowls meant something, everyone wanted to play in them (even all the players), New Year’s Day was an all day event and even the regional bickering over the polls was interesting.

I’m not sure how college football Survived without NIL or portals. Then again, I figured we’d all be driving flying cars and living like the Jetsons in 2022…

 

[Wexahu]

Like, say, the transfer portal and NIL money?

Jeff Bezos could pick the school he wants to win (I'd like him to pick his brother's college) and pay to make it happen.

Yes, that is making it much worse (especially the transfer portal) but I am talking more along the lines of a draft, or something similar. And I know that will NEVER happen so no need to tell me that.

 

[Peacefrog]

What's the solution? Maybe there isn't one.

Everyone seems to think we need more teams in the playoffs so they are more "inclusive" but that would result in more rematches than ever (like the NFL), and I guess you have no interest in watching teams that have already played each other. Maybe they could just pick different teams every year regardless of how well they do during the season just so we have new blood in the playoffs.

Just tuned into ESPN and Herbstreit and the rest of the panel were discussing the issues of college football and how games don't seem to matter anymore (four OSU starters sitting out the Rose Bowl). They didn't have any answers either but they clearly realize the sport pretty much sucks now, even though they are getting paid a crap ton of money to cover it.

There isn’t a fix. Only good idea is to let the 30 or so big money programs break off and do their thing. They get the recruits already. They spend the money already. Just do it. Second tier teams (like TCU will be) can build out that division in a way that makes sense. ESPN will still broadcast it. And there will be parity. I’d be all in on a second tier championship. It would at least have some drama to it.

This current system is going to backfire on espn. At least I hope it does.

 

[Wexahu]

There may be no solution. I thought the CFP would be a good thing, but I think it was much fun when the bowls meant something, everyone wanted to play in them (even all the players), New Year’s Day was an all day event and even the regional bickering over the polls was interesting.

I’m not sure how college football Survived without NIL or portals. Then again, I figured we’d all be driving flying cars and living like the Jetsons in 2022…

That's what the ESPN crew was discussing. They are out in Pasadena covering the Rose Bowl and guys are sitting out the game because it's not considered important enough. KH said if a player is only looking through the lens of establishing themselves as a 1st round NFL pick or whatever, then why play at all once they've established that, because through that lens the games don't matter. Skip entire seasons at that point.

KH asked what changed. I mean, many many times in the past the Rose Bowl outcome (and outcomes of all but a few of the bowls) didn't matter at all in terms of a national championships yet there was no way a player was going to sit out that game.

 

[BrewingFrog]

I don’t see how G5 teams can really measure up. It’s like if there are 100 kids on the playground and you’re dividing teams and you give one team the first 50 picks. Who do you think is gonna win the game?

As good as we want to think teams like Cincy are, in reality they maybe aren’t even in the Top 15, if they played the better teams week in and week out. And I know they beat ND.

Sigh.

See: 2009 Sugar Bowl.

 

[froginmn]

Yes, that is making it much worse (especially the transfer portal) but I am talking more along the lines of a draft, or something similar. And I know that will NEVER happen so no need to tell me that.

I think it might make it better, since Alabama doesn't have a particular benefit in terms of financial support. It isn't impossible to outbid Alabama for the services of a group of players.

 

[Wexahu]

Sigh.

See: 2009 Sugar Bowl.

And I know people don't wanna hear it, but that's a situation where you have a highly, highly motivated team looking to prove something playing one that might not be very motivated.

It makes a difference.

 

[BrewingFrog]

How long ago was it that the "sitting out" crap began? 4-5 years? Makes me want to puke...

Neither Fickell or Harbaugh had their teams prepared for what they faced yesterday. Cincy looked defeated mentally after the first Bama drive. Michigan looked like they were swimming through corn syrup. Both teams had played better in earlier games, yet came out cold after a long break, lots of hype, and long travel. Bama and Georgia had already been there, done that. They were well prepared, aware of their responsibilities, and confident.

 

[BrewingFrog]

And I know people don't wanna hear it, but that's a situation where you have a highly, highly motivated team looking to prove something playing one that might not be very motivated.

It makes a difference.

Uh huh. Sure. (Nods sarcastically.) I heard that same crap a few years later when OU managed to whip their ass, and the Excuse Machine coughed it out almost verbatim...

The scoreboard doesn't care.

My point is that this Magical Superiority doesn't exist to the extent you think it does, and that a sufficiently gifted Coach can motivate players beyond their normal capacities. After all, that's why they play the games.

 

[Wexahu]

How long ago was it that the "sitting out" crap began? 4-5 years? Makes me want to puke...

Neither Fickell or Harbaugh had their teams prepared for what they faced yesterday. Cincy looked defeated mentally after the first Bama drive. Michigan looked like they were swimming through corn syrup. Both teams had played better in earlier games, yet came out cold after a long break, lots of hype, and long travel. Bama and Georgia had already been there, done that. They were well prepared, aware of their responsibilities, and confident.

Alabama and Georgia are just better. And probably substantially so. Georgia did to Michigan's offense what they did to every offense they faced this year.....except Alabama. And a motivated and ready Bama team is going to beat Cincy I would guess 10 out of 10 times because they have bigger, stronger, faster, better players.

It's hard to win as a coach when the other team has a lot more talent. You probably need to catch the opponent not ready to play, and then you probably need bounces to go your way too, and that might not be good enough. It can get ugly pretty quickly, and often does.

 

[Wexahu]

Uh huh. Sure. (Nods sarcastically.) I heard that same crap a few years later when OU managed to whip their ass, and the Excuse Machine coughed it out almost verbatim...

The scoreboard doesn't care.

My point is that this Magical Superiority doesn't exist to the extent you think it does, and that a sufficiently gifted Coach can motivate players beyond their normal capacities. After all, that's why they play the games.

How could it not? An analogy would be if the NFL decided the Cowboys, Raiders, Giants, Bears and Steelers were going to get all the 1st, 2nd and 3rd round draft picks every year and then starting in round 4 the other 27 teams would be slotted in. How could those five teams not end up being clearly superior to the other 27?

That's what college football is. The Cincinnati's might hit on a few late bloomers that end up being really good and can play for anybody (just like an occasional 5th round draft choice) but by and large the elite programs are going to have vastly superior talent, and vastly superior depth.

I don't think it's Magical at all. I think it makes total sense and is pretty obvious myself.

 

[Pharm Frog]

I’m not sure what your point is. The two best teams made the championship game. They probably will continue to do so. I find it boring and most likely won’t watch attentively or at all. I’ve read this book already and know how it ends.

Hmmm. I’ve read the book and don’t care how it ends.

 

[QuilterFrawg]

Good luck, Oklahoma State!

 

[BrewingFrog]

How could it not? An analogy would be if the NFL decided the Cowboys, Raiders, Giants, Bears and Steelers were going to get all the 1st, 2nd and 3rd round draft picks every year and then starting in round 4 the other 27 teams would be slotted in. How could those five teams not end up being clearly superior to the other 27?

That's what college football is. The Cincinnati's might hit on a few late bloomers that end up being really good and can play for anybody (just like an occasional 5th round draft choice) but by and large the elite programs are going to have vastly superior talent, and vastly superior depth.

I don't think it's Magical at all. I think it makes total sense and is pretty obvious myself.

So, in the case of Cincy, it is a disparity of talent. How does that explain Michigan? They come from the B1G. Won the B1G as a matter of fact, beating the tar out of Mighty tOSU. Can't plead disparity of talent there now can we...

Are there other factors beyond the disposition of "talent" that come into play when the whistle blows? Methinks there are. This does not discount the "talent" angle at all, but as has been seen over and over again what a kid does in H.S. rarely translates into the same dominance in College. And, while teams like Florida are full of the very best talent, that talent is often wasted pointlessly. Every now and again, the stars align for a Program where the chance variables come together and they do wonderful things. But, it rarely lasts.

Alabama has achieved dominance through many avenues. Talent is most certainly one, but the proper evaluation of talent is key, as is the channeling of that talent in a fruitful direction through discipline and attrition. Managing to produce one Championship team over a 15 year span is a monumental achievement. Producing a slew of them, and being in the mix of all the others, is unprecedented. Saban has intelligently, and ruthlessly, removed many of the variables that could cause a lack of focus in his team. He stresses Old School fundamentals, and is merciless in seeing that his high standards of discipline, poise, and attention to detail are followed, not just among players but among his Staff as well.