Big 12 in position to poach Pac 12 schools?

[Limey Frog]

Sounds like Pac presidents rejected the current offer today. (ESPN 1/2 key games, w the rest on Apple TV). Don’t think that’s surprising based upon several reports. So now what does PAC commish do for a next step or what does any one PAC school do in reaction….

(credit to MHver3 on the bird app for that intel. I tried to paste that tweet but it’s protected or something)

This could very well be true, but I'll wait to see it from someone else. That guy throws way too much crap at the wall.

 

[jack the frog]

 

[Limey Frog]

Sounds like Pac presidents rejected the current offer today. (ESPN 1/2 key games, w the rest on Apple TV). Don’t think that’s surprising based upon several reports. So now what does PAC commish do for a next step or what does any one PAC school do in reaction….

(credit to MHver3 on the bird app for that intel. I tried to paste that tweet but it’s protected or something)

I will say this, if those numbers were correct (and that's roughly what a lot of people have projected), $80M/yr split 4 ways = ESPN's pro-rata share of the Big 12 deal's base annual payout. If Fox were to agree an additional share of their part that puts you at the money you need and gets ESPN what they want. Plus late night games for FS1.

I'm not saying that will happen, but if it did I think that's how/why.

 

[Eight]

Remember: The streamers reportedly want the Universities to pick up the costs of production. Not at all inexpensive.

The meetings should be fun. The truth might be painful.

run the production like frog vision and your costs are next to nothing

 

[jack the frog]

run the production like frog vision and your costs are next to nothing

I like it. GoPro cams on a pure streaming model. Profit.

 

[Eight]

It depends.
- If all 10 teams are delighted with the new contract and readily sign on; then staying at 10 might be doable and adding two Group teams wouldn’t be much of a benefit. SMU & SDSU will always be there for the taking.
- If the contract is seen as the bare minimum needed to hold the conference together; then SMU & SDSU would provide some insurance against any possible raid.
- If the contract is crap, Arizona & Colorado at a minimum will likely leave. SMU & SDSU would be must haves, and possibly a couple more Mtn West teams might be needed to stabilize the PAC.

adding smu, sdsu, and a couple of other mwc schools to provide "stability " if the pac loses the 4 corner schools after losing usc and ucla to the big 10 is similar to eating saltines and applesauce after contracting dysentery

not very appealing and really isn't go to slow the outflow

 

[Limey Frog]

adding smu, sdsu, and a couple of other mwc schools to provide "stability " if the pac loses the 4 corner schools after losing usc and ucla to the big 10 is similar to eating saltines and applesauce after contracting dysentery

not very appealing and really isn't go to slow the outflow

Right. I think if you saw the Pac vote to add SMU and SDSU in the next few weeks that would signal that a deal is imminent and all parties are sufficiently on board to anticipate signing it. If they did so, say, two months from now without news to the effect that a deal is in place it would more likely indicate that defections are imminent and Oregon State/Wazzu are driving expansion out of desperation to preemptively replace defectors.

 

[82 Frog Fever]

adding smu, sdsu, and a couple of other mwc schools to provide "stability " if the pac loses the 4 corner schools after losing usc and ucla to the big 10 is similar to eating saltines and applesauce after contracting dysentery

not very appealing and really isn't go to slow the outflow

Yes, terrible for sure.

But, not sure about outflow.
- Wash./Or. will probably stay in P12 as long as it has P5 status and wait for a possible B10 invite. They’d still be kings in a crappy P5 conference with an easy road to the playoffs.
- I don’t think Stanford or Cal. will be able to leave w/o a B10 invite.
- WASU & O St. are likely stuck no matter what.
- UU & ASU? Not sure what they’ll do, but if they stay, the P12 likely retains P5 status.

So, unless the B10 stirs the pot, the P12 should have at least 6 legacy teams trying to retain P5 status.

Is this P5?
Oregon, Wash, O.St., WASU, Cal., Stanford, SMU, SDSU, Fresno, Colo. St.
It’s better than the remaining Group conferences.

 

[Limey Frog]

Yes, terrible for sure.

But, not sure about outflow.
- Wash./Or. will probably stay in P12 as long as it has P5 status and wait for a possible B10 invite. They’d still be kings in a crappy P5 conference with an easy road to the playoffs.
- I don’t think Stanford or Cal. will be able to leave w/o a B10 invite.
- WASU & O St. are likely stuck no matter what.
- UU & ASU? Not sure what they’ll do, but if they stay, the P12 likely retains P5 status.

So, unless the B10 stirs the pot, the P12 should have at least 6 legacy teams trying to retain P5 status.

Is this P5?
Oregon, Wash, O.St., WASU, Cal., Stanford, SMU, SDSU, Fresno, Colo. St.

The winner of that league would get into the new playoff. Oregon and Washington could likely command a double pay-out from their desperate bedfellows, plus they could afford to leave at a moment's notice because they could negotiate a roughly AAC-level buyout.

 

[HG73]

Yes, terrible for sure.

​

But, not sure about outflow.

​

- Wash./Or. will probably stay in P12 as long as it has P5 status and wait for a possible B10 invite. They’d still be kings in a crappy P5 conference with an easy road to the playoffs.
- I don’t think Stanford or Cal. will be able to leave w/o a B10 invite.
- WASU & O St. are likely stuck no matter what.
- UU & ASU? Not sure what they’ll do, but if they stay, the P12 likely retains P5 status.

So, unless the B10 stirs the pot, the P12 should have at least 6 legacy teams trying to retain P5 status.

Is this P5?
Oregon, Wash, O.St., WASU, Cal., Stanford, SMU, SDSU, Fresno, Colo. St.

Yes, terrible for sure.

But, not sure about outflow.
- Wash./Or. will probably stay in P12 as long as it has P5 status and wait for a possible B10 invite. They’d still be kings in a crappy P5 conference with an easy road to the playoffs.
- I don’t think Stanford or Cal. will be able to leave w/o a B10 invite.
- WASU & O St. are likely stuck no matter what.
- UU & ASU? Not sure what they’ll do, but if they stay, the P12 likely retains P5 status.

So, unless the B10 stirs the pot, the P12 should have at least 6 legacy teams trying to retain P5 status.

Is this P5?
Oregon, Wash, O.St., WASU, Cal., Stanford, SMU, SDSU, Fresno, Colo. St.
It’s better than the remaining Group conferences.

No.

 

[Eight]

Yes, terrible for sure.

But, not sure about outflow.
- Wash./Or. will probably stay in P12 as long as it has P5 status and wait for a possible B10 invite. They’d still be kings in a crappy P5 conference with an easy road to the playoffs.
- I don’t think Stanford or Cal. will be able to leave w/o a B10 invite.
- WASU & O St. are likely stuck no matter what.
- UU & ASU? Not sure what they’ll do, but if they stay, the P12 likely retains P5 status.

So, unless the B10 stirs the pot, the P12 should have at least 6 legacy teams trying to retain P5 status.

Is this P5?
Oregon, Wash, O.St., WASU, Cal., Stanford, SMU, SDSU, Fresno, Colo. St.
It’s better than the remaining Group conferences.

does anyone want to endure that existence of laying in bed enduring a weakened, feverish state with the knowledge that any sneeze, cough, or rumble in the stomach is going to result in [ Finebaum ]ting on yourself again before you have time to act?

 

[82 Frog Fever]

does anyone want to endure that existence of laying in bed enduring a weakened, feverish state with the knowledge that any sneeze, cough, or rumble in the stomach is going to result in [ Finebaum ]ting on yourself again before you have time to act?

Yes, terrible, but I still find it interesting.
I could see the watering down of current P5 leagues as being the catalyst for forming the two 24 team super conferences in the future.

 

[Wexahu]

Yes, terrible for sure.

But, not sure about outflow.
- Wash./Or. will probably stay in P12 as long as it has P5 status and wait for a possible B10 invite. They’d still be kings in a crappy P5 conference with an easy road to the playoffs.
- I don’t think Stanford or Cal. will be able to leave w/o a B10 invite.
- WASU & O St. are likely stuck no matter what.
- UU & ASU? Not sure what they’ll do, but if they stay, the P12 likely retains P5 status.

So, unless the B10 stirs the pot, the P12 should have at least 6 legacy teams trying to retain P5 status.

Is this P5?
Oregon, Wash, O.St., WASU, Cal., Stanford, SMU, SDSU, Fresno, Colo. St.
It’s better than the remaining Group conferences.

I think it's better to stop thinking in terms of "P5". 5 is just a number.

It's going to be the SEC, the Big 10 and then everyone else in 2-3 years once this "realignment" (basically OU, UT, USC and UCLA getting settled in) gets a chance to marinate.

 

[82 Frog Fever]

I think it's better to stop thinking in terms of "P5". 5 is just a number.

It's going to be the SEC, the Big 10 and then everyone else in 2-3 years once this "realignment" (basically OU, UT, USC and UCLA getting settled in) gets a chance to marinate.

That should be interesting.
The 12 team playoff would be a definite obstacle.
Now that it’s in effect, it would be extremely difficult to exclude or impede 1/3 of current P5 teams without a giant lawsuit.

 

[Wexahu]

That should be interesting.
The 12 team playoff would be a definite obstacle.
Now that it’s in effect, it would be extremely difficult to exclude or impede 1/3 of current P5 teams without a giant lawsuit.

I just think the general sentiment and public opinion are going to be that those two leagues are so superior to everyone else its going to drive people that really get worked up about "lack of respect" or "bias" nuts.

Not sure what you mean by exclude or impede 1/3 of current P5 teams. The 12-team playoff will include at minimum 5 and up to 7 teams from the two big leagues each year. The other leagues won't be excluded, but they won't have an equal number of representatives as the big two, I can guarantee you that. Not even close.

That's what the people wanted though. So we've got it. Enjoy. I can't wait to hear the lack of bitching and complaining, lol.

 

[Limey Frog]

I just think the general sentiment and public opinion are going to be that those two leagues are so superior to everyone else its going to drive people that really get worked up about "lack of respect" or "bias" nuts.

Not sure what you mean by exclude or impede 1/3 of current P5 teams. The 12-team playoff will include at minimum 5 and up to 7 teams from the two big leagues each year. The other leagues won't be excluded, but they won't have an equal number of representatives as the big two, I can guarantee you that. Not even close.

That's what the people wanted though. So we've got it. Enjoy. I can't wait to hear the lack of bitching and complaining, lol.

I think this is right. For my part I don't care about the "disrespect" thing. Regarding the SEC, it's merited. The top programs in that conference are better: see what UGa and 'Bama just did to TCU and K-State... Regarding the Big Ten, not so much, but I live in Michigan and I can tell you there are a lot of people up here who love college sports, pay their cable bill every month, and do not care at all about anything outside the Big Ten. Until there are about two million more people who care about each and every member of the Big 12 (except BYU who already have plenty), the "respect" will be given as the market commands.

What I care about is stability and opportunity. TCU football is never going to be in Nebraska or Florida's position in the college football landscape, or be treated like it is. But we need to be in the best conference possible, as close as possible to the 'Big 2', and not have yet another league collapse on us because all our rivals move up to better leagues. We also need a chance to compete on the field. As we showed Michigan, we can beat the blue-bloods.

The Big 12 will never be, or be treated like it is, the SEC or Big Ten. We can't waste time getting our feelings hurt about that. But it can be the clear number 3 behind those two. It could, if things go very badly, still lose a few members to the Pac or ACC, and maybe those members don't include TCU. I think that scenario is unlikely at this point, but I don't believe we're out of the woods. I would like to be out of those woods--i.e., the deader the Pac/ACC are, the safer TCU football feels to me.

 

[82 Frog Fever]

I just think the general sentiment and public opinion are going to be that those two leagues are so superior to everyone else its going to drive people that really get worked up about "lack of respect" or "bias" nuts.

Not sure what you mean by exclude or impede 1/3 of current P5 teams. The 12-team playoff will include at minimum 5 and up to 7 teams from the two big leagues each year. The other leagues won't be excluded, but they won't have an equal number of representatives as the big two, I can guarantee you that. Not even close.

That's what the people wanted though. So we've got it. Enjoy. I can't wait to hear the lack of bitching and complaining, lol.

I see what you’re saying.
Personally I like the disrespect and arrogance. We deserved it against Georgia, and we got to shove it down the throats Wisconsin, Ole Miss, & Michigan.

If the B12 has 2 spots, I’ll be fine with that. I doubt we’d ever have more than 2 teams in any one season that could realistically compete at that level.

 

[Wexahu]

I think this is right. For my part I don't care about the "disrespect" thing. Regarding the SEC, it's merited. The top programs in that conference are better: see what UGa and 'Bama just did to TCU and K-State... Regarding the Big Ten, not so much, but I live in Michigan and I can tell you there are a lot of people up here who love college sports, pay their cable bill every month, and do not care at all about anything outside the Big Ten. Until there are about two million more people who care about each and every member of the Big 12 (except BYU who already have plenty), the "respect" will be given as the market commands.

What I care about is stability and opportunity. TCU football is never going to be in Nebraska or Florida's position in the college football landscape, or be treated like it is. But we need to be in the best conference possible, as close as possible to the 'Big 2', and not have yet another league collapse on us because all our rivals move up to better leagues. We also need a chance to compete on the field. As we showed Michigan, we can beat the blue-bloods.

The Big 12 will never be, or be treated like it is, the SEC or Big Ten. We can't waste time getting our feelings hurt about that. But it can be the clear number 3 behind those two. It could, if things go very badly, still lose a few members to the Pac or ACC, and maybe those members don't include TCU. I think that scenario is unlikely at this point, but I don't believe we're out of the woods. I would like to be out of those woods--i.e., the deader the Pac/ACC are, the safer TCU football feels to me.

While the Big 10 lacks in on field football performance, it has the most of what every league wants in almost every other category. It's on a par with the SEC in terms of it being full of very large state flagship schools with loyal fan bases, and the academic side (which I realize college sports fans care nothing about) is head and shoulders above the rest. That all means $$$. They will always have the following, and the money. The only thing it lacks is not being close to the Texas and Florida/southeast recruiting pool.

The quality of football in the middle to lower tiers of the league is certainly nothing special, but it doesn't really matter. They'll get their 3 playoff reps every year, and maybe a 4th in odd years, and be perfectly happy.

 

[Gary's Shirtless Revenge]

A little flavor...

- I said a few weeks back I thought the PAC was moving to try and close a deal... That was based on some rumblings from industry lawyers I know. That clearly didn't happen or work out. My guess is the PAC tried to close with ESPN, but they didn't get it done.

- Everybody in the industry believes PAC is working on an Apple deal, likely exclusive. They MAY get some licensed content on ESPN or elsewhere, but that'll be it. They are going to leverage all the fixed-cost investment in the PAC Network to make this work. Don't be surprised to see a big number announced eventually if this happens, but you'll have to keep in mind the PAC will need to fund all production costs.

- If this is the answer, expansion seems unlikely, other than maybe a Gonzaga side deal.

 

[Eight]

wild arse thought starting with the idea that the pac goes to a complete streaming deal with apple

how does anyone think that might impact a big 12, big 10, sec, or acc team from playing a pac school in a nonconference game if you know that instead of being on espn, abc, nbc,cbs etc.....you are on apple tv?

you play those games partly for the exposure or am i thinking too much on this....