Big 12 in position to poach Pac 12 schools?

[Big Frog II]

I believe the Pac's intention to adding teams is to get more inventory, pay the new schools far less during the short contract of 5-6 years so they can maximize the current Pac' members amounts. After those 5-6 years are over, the Big probably takes Oregon and Washington. Then the TV contract goes way down.

 

[JogginFrog]

Colorado’s research expenditures have increased 300 million annually since fleeing the Big XII for the PAC. They aren’t turning around now unless the Big Ten guts the PAC.

This was the big takeaway for me in the video that @peacock posted on p.3. I had no idea about the impact of research dollars in the calculus. I thought it was all reputational snobbery. Someone mentioned that it equated to 9% annual growth in research (less the costs against that of faculty & facilities), but the total research pie is so much bigger than the athletics pie, it seems almost pointless to debate about 2-3M/year differences in media contracts.

I get now why Arizona and Arizona State would be hesitant to jump to the Big 12, despite their recruiting ground being decimated.

The SMU candidacy also makes me wonder about TCU's aspirations on the research/academic front and how the potential for research growth plays into decisions. It would be a long-term play--difficult when the PAC seems on life support and the athletics landscape changes so quickly. Add to that the effect of losing regional rivals for a smaller fan/alumni base, and I guess it doesn't make sense for TCU to look west. But I can see better how college presidents look at things now.

Big opportunity for SMU, though. Maybe the ACC is a better fit for them, but it would be easier to make that move later from the PAC, even if it dies. Also, it seems like the school that stands to lose most from SMU-to-PAC, over time, is Baylor.

 

[Eight]

I believe the Pac's intention to adding teams is to get more inventory, pay the new schools far less during the short contract of 5-6 years so they can maximize the current Pac' members amounts. After those 5-6 years are over, the Big probably takes Oregon and Washington. Then the TV contract goes way down.

which again raises the question what do those schools bring to the table if you are already in a market or no one is paying attention in a new market

 

[HG73]

This was the big takeaway for me in the video that @peacock posted on p.3. I had no idea about the impact of research dollars in the calculus. I thought it was all reputational snobbery. Someone mentioned that it equated to 9% annual growth in research (less the costs against that of faculty & facilities), but the total research pie is so much bigger than the athletics pie, it seems almost pointless to debate about 2-3M/year differences in media contracts.

I get now why Arizona and Arizona State would be hesitant to jump to the Big 12, despite their recruiting ground being decimated.

The SMU candidacy also makes me wonder about TCU's aspirations on the research/academic front and how the potential for research growth plays into decisions. It would be a long-term play--difficult when the PAC seems on life support and the athletics landscape changes so quickly. Add to that the effect of losing regional rivals for a smaller fan/alumni base, and I guess it doesn't make sense for TCU to look west. But I can see better how college presidents look at things now.

Big opportunity for SMU, though. Maybe the ACC is a better fit for them, but it would be easier to make that move later from the PAC, even if it dies. Also, it seems like the school that stands to lose most from SMU-to-PAC, over time, is Baylor.

I heard those guys going on about the research money, but I find it hard to believe that the increase for these teams is a result of being in a football conference. Doubling your research money over 10 years is just about a 9 percent annual gain, something a research institute would probably do anyway. Not disagreeing with you Jogging.

 

[82 Frog Fever]

which again raises the question what do those schools bring to the table if you are already in a market or no one is paying attention in a new market

I believe it’s a tourniquet to temporarily stop the bleeding. Of course, gangrene & death follows.

 

[Dogfrog]

That's irrelevant. More people live in the suburbs than the city. The DFW population is pushing 8M.

The polpulations of FW, Dal, SA, and Austin are not irrelevant. If you want to argue that SA-Austin and all surrounding counties is smaller population than Dal- Tar and all surrounding counties, you would be correct by about a million people. The discussion was about the attractiveness of SMU because they are in Dallas.

 

[One Frog Nation]

When you look at who the Pac -12 could take, SMU > Fresno State, UNLV, Nevada, Boise State, Cal Poly. That being said, SMU's stadium is worse than several HS stadiums in the area. The parking is the worst of any stadium, I really don't see a good reason for them to be too interested. Except it does give them a foothold in Texas and a 2 time zone difference for tv games. But if that is what the Pac - 12 wants, go for it. The conference will be gone in 2 to 5 years anyway.

 

[Gary's Shirtless Revenge]

thoughts on the announcement by iger that disney is going to break espn off again on its "own" as well as split parks / entertainment and products?

we know they aren't going away and neither is the disney streaming platform so any thoughts on potential changes? they still will need content and live and rebroadcast of sports is cheaper than trying to create content or am i way off base in my thoughts.

They aren’t splitting it off, it’s just being reported on differently in their earnings. They can’t sell it, their whole cable business would fall apart.

Live sports and news are the most important live content, but they have no real lasting value… they are very expensive, still profitable, but less and less so by the day.

What he wants to sell is Hulu, he’s been shopping it for a month and I’d guess they’ll announce something by year end.

 

[Gary's Shirtless Revenge]

thoughts on the announcement by iger that disney is going to break espn off again on its "own" as well as split parks / entertainment and products?

we know they aren't going away and neither is the disney streaming platform so any thoughts on potential changes? they still will need content and live and rebroadcast of sports is cheaper than trying to create content or am i way off base in my thoughts.

I will say, for the past year to 18 months the refrain from espn in all rights agreements has been “discipline” and I think that is going to get more and more real. IE, they’d rather give up the late night Saturday CFB game than overpay for the PAC rights if that’s what it’d take to get it.

 

[One Frog Nation]

 

[Eight]

They aren’t splitting it off, it’s just being reported on differently in their earnings. They can’t sell it, their whole cable business would fall apart.

Live sports and news are the most important live content, but they have no real lasting value… they are very expensive, still profitable, but less and less so by the day.

What he wants to sell is Hulu, he’s been shopping it for a month and I’d guess they’ll announce something by year end.

do you think providers have a better understanding if streaming can or can't be profitable?

 

[TopFrog]

Might as well look at UTEP, University of North Texas and Texas State also.

 

[LVH]

Might as well look at UTEP, University of North Texas and Texas State also.

Might as well. The Pac-12 is going to be the MWC in a few years anyway, once Oregon and Washington inevitably leave, which will make Utah/Colorado/Arizona/Arizona State bolt for the Big 12 faster than you can blink.

Then all you have left is Stanford, Cal, Washington State, Oregon State, SMU and San Diego State.

At that point I could see Stanford/Cal either using their massive academic prowess to get a pity invite to the Big 10. At the very least, Stanford goes independent if they can't get into the Big 10. Cal probably does too, or drops down to FCS to play with schools like Cal Poly. No way do they stick around with what is left or join the MWC.

Then the Pac-4 of Washington State, Oregon State, SMU and San Diego State just gets absorbed into the MWC.

SMU's P5 status will be short lived.

 

[Gary's Shirtless Revenge]

do you think providers have a better understanding if streaming can or can't be profitable?

Streaming can be profitable, especially at scale. Google/YouTube and Netflix in the lead in their respective categories.

 

[DeuceBoogieNights]

The thing is,and I don't think I'm an outlier. I stream stuff but if it's not readily available in my streaming service of choice, I don't watch sports in that way.

Meaning, I turn on YouTube TV on Saturday and can pretty much switch between any game I want to watch. If I have to leave that to go Amazon to just watch one game, I'm not doing it unless it's my team. I'll just catch score updates on my phone. It would have to be a really compelling matchup and the pac only has a couple of those.

Look at the Thursday night NFL numbers for the Amazon stream. They're down. Sports fans want to easily flip. I don't know. How many people are watching games on ESPN+? Probably not many for those random games.

 

[Eight]

The thing is,and I don't think I'm an outlier. I stream stuff but if it's not readily available in my streaming service of choice, I don't watch sports in that way.

Meaning, I turn on YouTube TV on Saturday and can pretty much switch between any game I want to watch. If I have to leave that to go Amazon to just watch one game, I'm not doing it unless it's my team. I'll just catch score updates on my phone. It would have to be a really compelling matchup and the pac only has a couple of those.

Look at the Thursday night NFL numbers for the Amazon stream. They're down. Sports fans want to easily flip. I don't know. How many people are watching games on ESPN+? Probably not many for those random games.

one of my favorite things to do for a cheap laugh is watch my wife get frustrated trying to remember which streaming service has the show or movie she wants to watch

 

[The Artist Formerly Known as PhormerPhrog]

The polpulations of FW, Dal, SA, and Austin are not irrelevant. If you want to argue that SA-Austin and all surrounding counties is smaller population than Dal- Tar and all surrounding counties, you would be correct by about a million people. The discussion was about the attractiveness of SMU because they are in Dallas.

Try roughly 3 million. DFW has nearly 8M. SAATX is right at 5.

Dude, it has nothing to do with JUST Dallas. A conference that's desperate to find a favorable TV deal isn't adding SMU bc of Dallas's 1.3 million...it's adding them bc of DFW's 8m people. It was the same with TCU and the Big 12.

 

[The Artist Formerly Known as PhormerPhrog]

The polpulations of FW, Dal, SA, and Austin are not irrelevant. If you want to argue that SA-Austin and all surrounding counties is smaller population than Dal- Tar and all surrounding counties, you would be correct by about a million people. The discussion was about the attractiveness of SMU because they are in Dallas.

This is all a ridiculous argument anyway bc SMU is not in Dallas.

 

[Hemingway]

https://www.si.com/college/byu/foot...-set-to-aggressively-pursue-further-expansion

Basically Pac Commish over promised and no one is signing the current deal offered. All the Pac 12 coaches hate the streaming concept. Sounds promising for big 12

 

[Dogfrog]

Try roughly 3 million. DFW has nearly 8M. SAATX is right at 5.

Dude, it has nothing to do with JUST Dallas. A conference that's desperate to find a favorable TV deal isn't adding SMU bc of Dallas's 1.3 million...it's adding them bc of DFW's 8m people. It was the same with TCU and the Big 12.

Kind of pointless unless you define what the total area you are considering is. For grins, I added all the county populations of Tarrant, Dallas and all the counties immediately surrounding them and got about 7.3M. Add Bexar, Travis, Hays, Williamson and all those contiguous counties and it’s about 6.2M. Not sure there is any point to this.