AP: TCU chancellor: Gary Patterson apologized for use of racial slur

[steelfrog]

Except that is not what happened.

Patterson did not confront Dylan in front of his teammates. Patterson said the word when addressing the team the next day to clarify what was said during his meeting with Dylan because Dylan was telling people something different. During that clarification coach simply told the team what was said verbatim. Should he have? Probably not, but in that instance context does matter. The fact that Dylan acted like he didn't know what Coach was talking about until Patterson had to tell him the word that he was told Dylan was using in the locker room underscores how immature this young man is. Then he has the gall to use a private meeting as a social media attack (tagged it #BLM) on coach. I'm sorry, but Dylan is the villain, while Patterson made a mistake.

Then that is probably even worse, as Steel was giving him the benefit of heat-of-the-moment. Given the ability to coolly think about what he was going to say in front of a group of young black employees, this is a major blunder. So dumb.

Literally, Tx1999, you and I are pretty good buds and I would not say that word out loud to you while we are sitting in a restaurant. The idea of saying it to a room full of black young men, are you kidding me? He had MANY alternatives to express what was said without using the word. It is a hurtful word, regardless of context. Not sure why that's so hard to understand.

Not being critical of Gary--he made a mistake as we all do and he publicly apologized for it. He did the right thing there. But the way you all try to minimize it, when Gary himself recognizes the wrongness. Y'all are morons.

 

[Hoosierfrog]

You are viewing it only from the GP's subjective perspective. And, a very charitable view at that (i.e., you cannot know WHAT his intent was).

Have you considered the fact that there are other perspectives by which GP's words could be judged by? That is, the audience perspective. Why do you place all emphasis on GP's intent and not the perspective of the audience? Do you think it would have been helpful to avoid this episode if GP had thought about his audience before saying what he did?

Steel will ask you a very simple question, and you will answer it ya miserable pile of unadulterated dograp:

Would you, an old, white Hoosier, surrounded by a group of young black employees of yours, use the N word in ANY context?

Answer the damn question.

I stated above that I would not, but also said in the context and intent I would only do so because of the over-sensitivity that has been placed on this word whether the intent is to offend or to use it has a negative example of the language.

I see a clear difference in calling someone a dirty [ Finebaum ]e head and telling someone you would appreciate not using the word [ Finebaum ]e.

 

[Eight]

Context is the the way it was used. The way it was used was as an example of a word he doesn’t want to be used in his locker room. Intent is also a factor. There was no racist intent with the usage of the word and that is the whole crux of this whole to do. I probably wouldn’t use it in any context, not that I agree that the word used the way it was by GP was offensive, but because the over-sensitivity of our culture to it when not used to offend.

had a discussion with a younger friend on the idea in their mind that some are hesitant to step forward and express themselves on various issues be it covid, race, environment, politics etc...

what has happened here to me provides a snap shot of the struggles we as a society are having and why we absolutely must listen, get off social media, and work to find middle ground

gary thinks he is doing the right thing and "offends" dylan, dylan doesn't go to gary, but to some teammates

the group brings this to gary's attention as they should, a discussion is had, and for the most part the issue is resolved. dylan has decided for whatever reason to not let it go and in the end it will be up to him to either forgive or let it deter his life. learned far too late that holding grudges when you are sure you are right do no good for anyone.

lynn mentions in one of his posts that the group has talked with gary about not only use of the WORD, but also gary's belief he doesn't see color, he sees them all as his players. i truly believe gary sees them as his players and one group.

the irony being that gary comes from a time where we have had it beaten into our heads that we should not see color, race, or creed but see all people as the same. now he is being told by his players he shouldn't see them all the same.

i might have this wrong, but i truly think when a 19-20 something gets frustrated with someone older about some of this they don't understand they are expecting a shift in thinking which is counter to what we were told we needed to do and be in order to be tolerant

 

[TxFrog1999]

Then that is probably even worse, as Steel was giving him the benefit of heat-of-the-moment. Given the ability to coolly think about what he was going to say in front of a group of young black employees, this is a major blunder. So dumb.

Literally, Tx1999, you and I are pretty good buds and I would not say that word out loud to you while we are sitting in a restaurant. The idea of saying it to a room full of black young men, are you kidding me? He had MANY alternatives to express what was said without using the word. It is a hurtful word, regardless of context. Not sure why that's so hard to understand.

Not being critical of Gary--he made a mistake as we all do and he publicly apologized for it. He did the right thing there. But the way you all try to minimize it, when Gary himself recognizes the wrongness. Y'all are morons.

I'm not minimizing it. I fully agree with you that Patterson made a mistake, and I have no problem with him apologizing to the team leadership, and it sounds like the players completely understand where coach was coming from and he understands their point on the matter. My point of disagreement with your assessment is painting Patterson as the villain in this story when Dylan was the one who lied about his meeting with Patterson to his teammates which forced the issue to be brought up in a team meeting the next day, then took to Twitter to mislead the public while invoking BLM to try and score points on his coach because he was upset about not getting playing time or being thrown out of a position meeting for acting like an ass.

 

[steelfrog]

I stated above that I would not, but also said in the context and intent I would only do So because of the over-sensitivity that has been placed on this word whether the intend is to offend or to use it has a negative example of the language.

I see a clear difference in calling someone a dirty [ Cumbie’s red zone playcalling ]e head and telling someone you would appreciate not using the word [ Cumbie’s red zone playcalling ]e.

Once again, you say over-sensitivity. Steel is serious with this question--what do you base your characterization of "over-sensitivity" on? Steel don't see how he, as a white man, can say that blacks are over-sensitive in how they react to that word, particularly uttered by a white person. It is important to understand why you think they are over sensitive?

 

[Hoosierfrog]

I stated above that I would not, but also said in the context and intent I would only do So because of the over-sensitivity that has been placed on this word whether the intend is to offend or to use it has a negative example of the language.

I see a clear difference in calling someone a dirty [ Cumbie’s red zone playcalling ]e head and telling someone you would appreciate not using the word [ Cumbie’s red zone playcalling ]e.

Brother, to be clear, the censored word did not have an n in it. It began with shi and ended in e.

 

[TxFrog1999]

the irony being that gary comes from a tie where we have had it beaten into our heads that we should see color, race, or creed but see all people as the same. now he is being told by his players he shouldn't see them all the same.

i might have this wrong, but i truly think when a 19-20 something gets frustrated with someone older about some of this they don't understand they are expecting a shift in thinking which is counter to what we were told we needed to do and be in order to be tolerant

I've encountered this on campus with faculty, the issue is that those of us in Gen X are being misunderstood when we use the phrase "color blind." The younger generation thinks that means we don't see them, but that isn't what that phrase means. We don't see color in how we teat someone, obviously we see them as an individual with unique traits and talents, but we don't use color in how we decide to treat another person. The fact that this has been weaponized by the radical left is just another attempt at dividing generations and create issues between "intersectional groups."

 

[Zubaz]

He did something wrong by correcting a knucklehead?

No, he did something wrong by using the word itself. There are better ways to correct the guy.

His players, aside from the knucklehead, don't seem to think he did anything wrong.

Incorrect. As you can see from the player tweets, notably Moehrig's and Barber's, they felt Patterson made a mistake and needed to apologize, but also (rightly) felt that Dylan was wrong to take it public. More to the point, both the team and the coach are working together to move forward.

He used the word only in telling someone else who was using the word to stop using it, and it has created this. I mean seriously, it is truly a bizzare world we live in.

And there are better ways to do that, that's all. Hence the whole "teachable moment". It's not some fireable offense or the crime of the century, but nobody is really saying it is. He made a mistake, he apologized. End of. Seems now there are people mad that Patterson had to own up to the mistake he made, rather than simply saying "Great, perfect, everyone is all good and we can move on".

 

[Hoosierfrog]

Once again, you say over-sensitivity. Steel is serious with this question--what do you base your characterization of "over-sensitivity" on? Steel don't see how he, as a white man, can say that blacks are over-sensitive in how they react to that word, particularly uttered by a white person. It is important to understand why you think they are over sensitive?

Sensitivity is when you get offended by a word which is not used to offend, but as an example of something that when used to offend should not be allowed. When used as an example of or description something offensive it is just a word. When used to offend it is a tool of hate. I see a clear distinction. I don’t expect everyone to agree and I’m not trying to change your opinion. I’m just pointing out there is an obvious distinction.

I’m also not saying he couldn’t have handled this better. God only knows, GP probably wishes he had at this point.

 

[BrewingFrog]

Sensitivity is when you get offended by something which is not Used to offend, but as an example of something that when used to offend should not be allowed. When used as an example of or description something offensive it is just a word. When used to offend it is a tool of hate. I see a clear distinction. I don’t expect everyone to agree and I’m not trying to change your opinion. I’m just pointing out There is an obvious distinction.

Well said.

 

[steelfrog]

Sensitivity is when you get offended by something which is not Used to offend, but as an example of something that when used to offend should not be allowed. When used as an example of or description something offensive it is just a word. When used to offend it is a tool of hate. I see a clear distinction. I don’t expect everyone to agree and I’m not trying to change your opinion. I’m just pointing out there is an obvious distinction.

Right, so if Steel in his subjective intent and without regard for his audience, uses a word that his audience is offended by, then if Steel didn't mean it in a bad way, no matter what it is, then it's the audience that is in the wrong. Is that what you mean?

Steel is a student of history--literally reads and listens to audio books and podcasts daily. You do realize, don't you, that this is the exact line of reasoning used by Hitler when he was pursuing his eugenics "project" that killed 200,000 German and other nationalities who had genetic defects or were otherwise adjudged unworthy of living. Mostly children. (And of course was the precursor to the Holocaust.) Subjectively, Hitler was convinced he was doing what was best for these children by killing them. But since he subjectively believed he was doing right, what the children happen to think, if different, just doesn't matter, does it?

Is that what you mean?

@TxFrog1999 probably agrees with you. As does the [ "illegitimate Baylor boy" ] @Frognosticator , who was BORN AND RAISED IN, you guessed it, GERMANY.

Deutchland Deutchland Uber Alles!

 

[Zubaz]

Who had "Page 2" on their "When do Nazi analogies came out" bet?

 

[Eight]

Right, so if Steel in his subjective intent and without regard for his audience, uses a word that his audience is offended by, then if Steel didn't mean it in a bad way, no matter what it is, then it's the audience that is in the wrong. Is that what you mean?

Steel is a student of history--literally reads and listens to audio books and podcasts daily. You do realize, don't you, that this is the exact line of reasoning used by Hitler when he was pursuing his eugenics "project" that killed 200,000 German and other nationalities who had genetic defects or were otherwise adjudged unworthy of living. Mostly children. (And of course was the precursor to the Holocaust.) Subjectively, Hitler was convinced he was doing what was best for these children by killing them. But since he subjectively believed he was doing right, what the children happen to think, if different, just doesn't matter, does it?

Is that what you mean?

@TxFrog1999 probably agrees with you. As does the [ "illegitimate Baylor boy" ] @Frognosticator , who was BORN AND RAISED IN, you guessed it, GERMANY.

Deutchland Deutchland Uber Alles!

damn.... not sure if even lvh or tyler can touch the bar you just set steel

 

[Frognosticator]

Right, so if Steel in his subjective intent and without regard for his audience, uses a word that his audience is offended by, then if Steel didn't mean it in a bad way, no matter what it is, then it's the audience that is in the wrong. Is that what you mean?

Steel is a student of history--literally reads and listens to audio books and podcasts daily. You do realize, don't you, that this is the exact line of reasoning used by Hitler when he was pursuing his eugenics "project" that killed 200,000 German and other nationalities who had genetic defects or were otherwise adjudged unworthy of living. Mostly children. (And of course was the precursor to the Holocaust.) Subjectively, Hitler was convinced he was doing what was best for these children by killing them. But since he subjectively believed he was doing right, what the children happen to think, if different, just doesn't matter, does it?

Is that what you mean?

@TxFrog1999 probably agrees with you. As does the [ "illegitimate Baylor boy" ] @Frognosticator , who was BORN AND RAISED IN, you guessed it, GERMANY.

Deutchland Deutchland Uber Alles!

It's Deutschland, you scheissing moron.

 

[BrewingFrog]

It's Deutschland, you scheissing moron.

Forget it. He's rolling...

 

[PhillyFrog]

had a discussion with a younger friend on the idea in their mind that some are hesitant to step forward and express themselves on various issues be it covid, race, environment, politics etc...

what has happened here to me provides a snap shot of the struggles we as a society are having and why we absolutely must listen, get off social media, and work to find middle ground

gary thinks he is doing the right thing and "offends" dylan, dylan doesn't go to gary, but to some teammates

the group brings this to gary's attention as they should, a discussion is had, and for the most part the issue is resolved. dylan has decided for whatever reason to not let it go and in the end it will be up to him to either forgive or let it deter his life. learned far too late that holding grudges when you are sure you are right do no good for anyone.

lynn mentions in one of his posts that the group has talked with gary about not only use of the WORD, but also gary's belief he doesn't seem color, he sees them all as his players. i truly believe gary sees them as his players and one group.

the irony being that gary comes from a time where we have had it beaten into our heads that we should not see color, race, or creed but see all people as the same. now he is being told by his players he shouldn't see them all the same.

i might have this wrong, but i truly think when a 19-20 something gets frustrated with someone older about some of this they don't understand they are expecting a shift in thinking which is counter to what we were told we needed to do and be in order to be tolerant

Hard agree, full stop.

 

[Mean Purple]

I've encountered this on campus with faculty, the issue is that those of us in Gen X are being misunderstood when we use the phrase "color blind." The younger generation thinks that means we don't see them, but that isn't what that phrase means. We don't see color in how we teat someone, obviously we see them as an individual with unique traits and talents, but we don't use color in how we decide to treat another person. The fact that this has been weaponized by the radical left is just another attempt at dividing generations and create issues between "intersectional groups."

While some of the Gen Z and Gen Y crowd my think of it that way, it is not out of line to say that some do know better and use it for new movement leverage, thus taking away from the effectiveness of the movement as far as it pertains to real social justice. And those that innocently think of it that way, could have been pushed in that direction by others who are using it for not well intended leverage.

Just think about it. If you want racial equality, you don't want people making decisions based on race. That exclusive and wrong approach has some bad history to it. Yet, some are trying to use reverse logic and just push racial tension. Going out there and claiming that someone who tries to treat people equally is somehow racist because of some baseless claim of "white priv" is as much a failed claim as it is hypocritical.

Someone knowingly went out and lied to those kids, to tell them not basing decisions of someones skin color and giving folks equal chances is somehow racist. They did not come up with that on their own.

Call out the evils of prejudice when it really exists But don't go making agressive strife/conflict between folks who get along for the sake of power games.

These kids have enough to deal with ... getting through school, getting into college, getting through college, finding a job, etc. They don't need some self
repressed, so-called "woke" activists, profs and journalists making up conflict that may not really be there.

Part of me thinks that is why some hope the football season won't happen. Keep things from normal and keep people upset. Keep playing power games.

 

[Mean Purple]

Right, so if Steel in his subjective intent and without regard for his audience, uses a word that his audience is offended by, then if Steel didn't mean it in a bad way, no matter what it is, then it's the audience that is in the wrong. Is that what you mean?

Steel is a student of history--literally reads and listens to audio books and podcasts daily. You do realize, don't you, that this is the exact line of reasoning used by Hitler when he was pursuing his eugenics "project" that killed 200,000 German and other nationalities who had genetic defects or were otherwise adjudged unworthy of living. Mostly children. (And of course was the precursor to the Holocaust.) Subjectively, Hitler was convinced he was doing what was best for these children by killing them. But since he subjectively believed he was doing right, what the children happen to think, if different, just doesn't matter, does it?

Is that what you mean?

@TxFrog1999 probably agrees with you. As does the [ "illegitimate Baylor boy" ] @Frognosticator , who was BORN AND RAISED IN, you guessed it, GERMANY.

Deutchland Deutchland Uber Alles!

How incredibly inconsiderate of you.
Some were born in West Germany as their parents served in effort of freedom for all. Yet, you make no effort to recognize that importance. Nor do you recognize that those who were born in West Germany no longer have their own choice to identify what part of Germany it was.

You refusal to see that you did not see it that way, along with your refusal to see that you meant to do that even though you did not mean to do that makes you guilty of some sort of your own skin color based privilege even though you may have had to work just as hard as anybody else to get where you are.

 

[Frognosticator]

How incredibly inconsiderate of you.
Some were born in West Germany as their parents served in effort of freedom for all. Yet, you make no effort to recognize that importance. Nor do you recognize that those who were born in West Germany no longer have their own choice to identify what part of Germany it was.

You refusal to see that you did not see it that way, along with your refusal to see that you meant to do that even though you did not mean to do that makes you guilty of some sort of your own skin color based privilege even though you may have had to work just as hard as anybody else to get where you are.

Not only that, but he couldn't even spell Deutschland correctly. You should all be ashamed to have graduated from the same university as Steel.

 

[PhillyFrog]

I think Gary did the right thing throughout. His reputational capital will likely be bettered having gone through this, and I don't see any issues with negative recruiting since the prospects will likely be fully informed on the details.

And I'd rather have this kind of BLM episode, than be stuck with the Eyes Of Texas one down in Austin.