Here's the BIG problem with firing JC

[Punter1]

That no one worth anything (besides BG and his drinking problem) is gonna want this job. The roster is [Craig James], the arena is [Craig James], the student/fan support is [Craig James]. Rebuilding job is a huge understatement and no one with any sense is gonna come here and risk getting run in 3 more years under thse conditions.

So only damaged goods (BG) is gonna want this job or were looking at some assistant in the SWAC as the best option...just kidding obviously but without a 4 yr deal I wouldn't touch this job with a 10 ft pole.

 

[PurpleBlood87]

I'm sorry but there is nothing wrong with the seating area in DMC. It's the perfect size for the school and when it is full that place can get load and rocking. What needs to be revamped is the concourse area. From what I remember the plans are to remodel the concourse the way Wichita State remodeled its concourse. Making it wider with better concessions areas and I'm guessing more restrooms that you don't have go down stairs to get too. As for Christian, I don't think TCU can afford to pay out the final year of his contract and then pay for a top-flight coach.

 

[TopFrog]

DMC is not what's holding the program back.

 

[Limey Frog]

We are located in the DFW metro, have great resources, and are about to join the Big East. I think you're going to see some impressive applicants if this job opens up.

 

[perryfrog]

DMC is not what's holding the program back.

Man, you got that right. :blink:

GO FROGS!!!!

 

[zfrawg]

DMC is not what's holding the program back.

He's not saying the arena alone is holding us back. All the issues are cumulative. If we had great crowds and sufficient talent, the arena wouldn't be a killer.. I like the place and as stated when full it is a great place to watch a game. It's a chicken and egg thing here I think. So yes the arena for is is a huge drawback for any coach.

 

[TopFrog]

So yes the arena for is is a huge drawback for any coach.

Only for coaches who can't get people to come to it. It wasn't a drawback for Killer or Billy.

 

[Punter1]

Yes it is all cumlative...but the seating does suck in DMC. if you are going to have [Craig James] for a team then have a arena that is inviting to come to. We need seats on the floor. It needs to be brighter and with a better sound sysem.

Out of all the D1 college arenas in Tx...where would you put ours??? I'm talking based upon what a recruit would want to sign up for and where a student would want to come to. Not what a 50 year old alumni likes. And be honest...

And I'm tired of the arguement...Well Tubbs sold it out. Of coarse he did, he could sell out DMC if it sat in the middle of Poly. I loooove Tubbs...but he gone and there aren't any run and gun coaches like him left. Blow up DMC and get a place that decent recruits say..."This place looks fun to play in." And students say..."This place is fun to go yell and scream at." Right now neither does.

 

[TCUSA]

The point I made at the time was that Billy Tubbs was the ONLY draw we had to TCU. All the pressure brought to bear to get rid of him was, IMO, short-sighted and somewhat delusional. We have a VERY shallow basketball history. Killer was a great coach and did more with less than anybody I've seen. But he was unique and his legacy wasn't long enough to cement us as a legitimate basketball program. Billy was a nice carry-over. He had baggage, too--but far less than BG. Tubbs' main issue was the tournament committee--something he (and we) had no ability to influence. We finished with RPI's in the 40's twice that we didn't get an invitation to the tourny which was overtly politically influenced. But Tubbs' issue with the tournament was the times he'd beaten committee members' teams--many of them, badly. You think they're going to smile any more favorably on BG's baggage? I doubt it.

The Big East is a huge draw that I hope Christian can capitalize on. I haven't seen a game yet, but from what little I've seen and from what I've read and heard, it's far more a talent problem than a coaching one. The move to the BE should mitigate a large portion of that talent issue (though how much of it remains to be seen). But I think dumping Christian at this point, even though the raw data of wins and losses could justify it, would, IMO, be premature when taken in context.

 

[oldscribe]

Only for coaches who can't get people to come to it. It wasn't a drawback for Killer or Billy.

Right!

 

[oldscribe]

The point I made at the time was that Billy Tubbs was the ONLY draw we had to TCU. All the pressure brought to bear to get rid of him was, IMO, short-sighted and somewhat delusional. We have a VERY shallow basketball history. Killer was a great coach and did more with less than anybody I've seen. But he was unique and his legacy wasn't long enough to cement us as a legitimate basketball program. Billy was a nice carry-over. He had baggage, too--but far less than BG. Tubbs' main issue was the tournament committee--something he (and we) had no ability to influence. We finished with RPI's in the 40's twice that we didn't get an invitation to the tourny which was overtly politically influenced. But Tubbs' issue with the tournament was the times he'd beaten committee members' teams--many of them, badly. You think they're going to smile any more favorably on BG's baggage? I doubt it.

The Big East is a huge draw that I hope Christian can capitalize on. I haven't seen a game yet, but from what little I've seen and from what I've read and heard, it's far more a talent problem than a coaching one. The move to the BE should mitigate a large portion of that talent issue (though how much of it remains to be seen). But I think dumping Christian at this point, even though the raw data of wins and losses could justify it, would, IMO, be premature when taken in context.

Well reasoned, sir!

 

[West Coast Johnny]

No. I disagree with you. The TCU job with no expectations and going into the Big East is a good job.

 

[gohornedfrogs]

If Baylor can come back from a worse situation than ours, then I'll remain hopeful.

It can be done.

 

[FeistyFrog]

How many times did DMC sell out under Killer? I remember watching Arkie v TCU and the place wasn't close to a sell out. My guess is 1.

How many under Tubbs? My guess is 3.

 

[Big Frog II]

How many times did DMC sell out under Killer? I remember watching Arkie v TCU and the place wasn't close to a sell out. My guess is 1.

How many under Tubbs? My guess is 3.

Fiesty I hate to tell you but you would be wrong. During Killer's last two years alone, most every SWC was sold out. In fact his last year, probably only the Rice game did not sell out in SWC play. As for Billy, during his best years, we sold our regularly. NM, Utah, SMU, Fresno, even Hawaii sold out. We even sold out the Oklahoma State game after Christmas with the students gone, OSU playing in a bowl game that night and they didn't have 20 fans themselves.

The city, alumni, and the students will support a team that wins regularly and is competitive. Unfortunately, we have not seen that in years.

 

[froginaustin]

I watched a bit of Wichita State's game on Jan. 29. Their basketball house looks fine. I've seen WSU's place on line, and it looks great with modern concourses, etc.

Seating comes all the way down to the edge of the court, and those court-side seats were full of noisy obnoxious students.

DM is of an age that TCU might run into an asbestos remediation problem with a remodel. Other than some horrible problem like that, I see no reason not to update what we have. There is certainly no reason to build any bigger (except to add court-side seats, and increasing capacity is certainly not the reason to do that).

I was in school during the Johnny Swaim years, when we had decent to SWC champ teams. We had a few sellouts, but not many. At least 1 was a year in which A&M was also pretty good, and brought a fair number (too many) visitors.

 

[FeistyFrog]

Fiesty I hate to tell you but you would be wrong. During Killer's last two years alone, most every SWC was sold out. In fact his last year, probably only the Rice game did not sell out in SWC play. As for Billy, during his best years, we sold our regularly. NM, Utah, SMU, Fresno, even Hawaii sold out. We even sold out the Oklahoma State game after Christmas with the students gone, OSU playing in a bowl game that night and they didn't have 20 fans themselves.

The city, alumni, and the students will support a team that wins regularly and is competitive. Unfortunately, we have not seen that in years.

Well just went to the history archives and this is what I got:

Killer years: 4 games at 7,200 or above, another 10 at 7,166 (avg less than 2 a year)

Tubbs: 2 games at 7,200 or above, another 10 at 7,166 (avg less than 2 a year)

CND had 2 games above 7,200

 

[angelo's frog]

Yes it is all cumlative...but the seating does suck in DMC. if you are going to have [Craig James] for a team then have a arena that is inviting to come to. We need seats on the floor. It needs to be brighter and with a better sound sysem.

Out of all the D1 college arenas in Tx...where would you put ours??? I'm talking based upon what a recruit would want to sign up for and where a student would want to come to. Not what a 50 year old alumni likes. And be honest...

And I'm tired of the arguement...Well Tubbs sold it out. Of coarse he did, he could sell out DMC if it sat in the middle of Poly. I loooove Tubbs...but he gone and there aren't any run and gun coaches like him left. Blow up DMC and get a place that decent recruits say..."This place looks fun to play in." And students say..."This place is fun to go yell and scream at." Right now neither does.

It's plenty bright and the sound system sounded very good to me the last couple of times I was there. I agree that it would be better if the seats went all the way to the court. However, I don't know how difficult that would be to do in the current building. At the most, I think take the seating bowl down to the floor and widen the concourses while putting in some luxury boxes. You might lose a bunch of seats to the boxes and concourses but gain some with moving the seats in toward the court. If it's a net loss of a few hundred seats or even more, that would be fine with me.

 

[froginaustin]

I didn't get a real good look at the seating, because WSU's court-side seats were full of people while their game was on TV. But from what I could see, I wouldn't be surprised if the seating bowl was left alone, and provisions made for temporary bleacher-type seats from the edge of the bowl to court side. That's the way UTx's Irwin Center works, and they can take out the temporary seats when appropriate for uses other than basketball.

 

[KillerFrog InD KitchenSink]

The point I made at the time was that Billy Tubbs was the ONLY draw we had to TCU. All the pressure brought to bear to get rid of him was, IMO, short-sighted and somewhat delusional. We have a VERY shallow basketball history. Killer was a great coach and did more with less than anybody I've seen. But he was unique and his legacy wasn't long enough to cement us as a legitimate basketball program. Billy was a nice carry-over. He had baggage, too--but far less than BG. Tubbs' main issue was the tournament committee--something he (and we) had no ability to influence. We finished with RPI's in the 40's twice that we didn't get an invitation to the tourny which was overtly politically influenced. But Tubbs' issue with the tournament was the times he'd beaten committee members' teams--many of them, badly. You think they're going to smile any more favorably on BG's baggage? I doubt it.

The Big East is a huge draw that I hope Christian can capitalize on. I haven't seen a game yet, but from what little I've seen and from what I've read and heard, it's far more a talent problem than a coaching one. The move to the BE should mitigate a large portion of that talent issue (though how much of it remains to be seen). But I think dumping Christian at this point, even though the raw data of wins and losses could justify it, would, IMO, be premature when taken in context.

Yeah, I agree with this.

I think the worst thing a program can do is create a revolving door of coaches. Three years is just too short, unless there is off the field/court issues with a coach.