• The KillerFrogs

Head-to-Head

PineyWoodsFrog

Active Member
With the CFP teams being decided this week and the usual discussions about who should be in/out, I wanted to see what everyone's opinion was on the head-to-head criteria. Most notably, this would apply to Texas/Bama this year. Here are my thoughts:

I can remember 2 instances off the top of my head where the loser of a game between 1-loss teams ended up in the championship game and I didn't have a problem with either: 2000 Florida State (lost to Miami), 2008 Oklahoma (lost to Texas). Miami lost to #15 Washington and Texas lost to #7 Texas Tech. People tend to forget these things when talking about head-to-head in today's format.

I'm aware that this was the BCS-era, which looked at the season in totality and did not use head-to-head as a predictor of who should be in. I think I'm one of the few that actually didn't mind the BCS. When we went to playoff format, I wanted to keep it and just take the top 4 from it. It had some flaws, but I thought it was way better than a biased selection committee.

I am of the belief that the best team does not always win a particular game. Losing a head-to-head matchup just means you were not better that day. It doesn't mean you are not the better team THROUGHOUT the season.

We've seen teams lose very early in the season, fall in the polls, and go on a streak to end up right back where they fell from, as opposed to losing late in the season and not having time to make up ground. If WHEN you lose matters, shouldn't WHEN the head-to-head was played matter just as much? Once the winner of the head-to-head matchup loses, are the teams basically even and should be judged on their entire season or should the head-to-head be the deciding factor? Should WHO you lose to matter? The committee doesn't seem to focus much on who you lose to as much as who you beat. In 2014, I thought Ohio State losing at home to a 6-6 Virginia Tech team by 2 TDs would hold more weight than it did and maybe it would have if we weren't the team they were being compared to, but that was also early in the season, which probably also factored in.

What say y'all? Do y'all feel head-to-head should be the deciding factor or is it dependent on what happens the rest of the season? I'm sure all of us felt that we should have been selected over Baylor in 2014 if it had come down to the two of us because it's hard not to be bias in that situation. However, did you feel that way after we played them, after they lost to West Virginia, or was your opinion based on the CFP rankings?
 

Zubaz

Member
If Alabama beats Georgia, it would be TWO "head to head" debates, because you would also have one-loss Bama vs the one-loss Georgia that they beat as well as the 1-loss team that beat Bama too.

I'm wondering if in that situation I they pick Texas just to avoid the Bama-Georgia debate altogether (I do think this was at least somewhat a factor in 2014 as well).

That said, I don't think Bama beats Georgia. These things will probably take care of themselves.
 

Wexahu

Full Member
If Alabama beats Georgia, it would be TWO "head to head" debates, because you would also have one-loss Bama vs the one-loss Georgia that they beat as well as the 1-loss team that beat Bama too.

I'm wondering if in that situation I they pick Texas just to avoid the Bama-Georgia debate altogether (I do think this was at least somewhat a factor in 2014 as well).

That said, I don't think Bama beats Georgia. These things will probably take care of themselves.
I just can’t believe the SEC wouldn’t be part of a playoff. It’s the best league.

Anyway, I don’t like the “winner of the hth matchup should always be ahead in the rankings” theory. Teams play 12-13 games, when you do that you’re not considering the loss the other team had, where the game was played, point margins, etc. ALL games and their outcomes need to be given equal consideration in a format like this IMO.

I think in that scenario it’d be Georgia out and Alabama and Texas in. I wouldn’t necessarily think those are the three best teams, I’d probably rank them UGA, Bama and UT in that order (unless Bama beats Georgia handily). But that’s how I think it would end up. Right now, with FSUs QB hurt, they might not be one of the 8 best teams but they’ll get in if they win Saturday, and I wouldn’t have a problem with that.
 

Zubaz

Member
I just can’t believe the SEC wouldn’t be part of a playoff. It’s the best league.

Anyway, I don’t like the “winner of the hth matchup should always be ahead in the rankings” theory. Teams play 12-13 games, when you do that you’re not considering the loss the other team had, where the game was played, point margins, etc. ALL games and their outcomes need to be given equal consideration in a format like this IMO.

I think in that scenario it’d be Georgia out and Alabama and Texas in. I wouldn’t necessarily think those are the three best teams, I’d probably rank them UGA, Bama and UT in that order (unless Bama beats Georgia handily). But that’s how I think it would end up. Right now, with FSUs QB hurt, they might not be one of the 8 best teams but they’ll get in if they win Saturday, and I wouldn’t have a problem with that.
I don't disagree, but I could see them thinking they're backed in to a corner. Like I said though, I don't think it will come up.

And yeah, undefeated FSU is not being left out though, even if we know they'd get raced in the CFP without their QB. WE ALL know that.
 

TooColdU

Active Member
I don't disagree, but I could see them thinking they're backed in to a corner. Like I said though, I don't think it will come up.

And yeah, undefeated FSU is not being left out though, even if we know they'd get raced in the CFP without their QB. WE ALL know that.
We all knew they sucked back in 2014 when we got left out just because they were undefeated.

They ended up getting killed in the semifinals.
 

Zubaz

Member
We all knew they sucked back in 2014 when we got left out just because they were undefeated.

They ended up getting killed in the semifinals.
Simpsons Thats The Joke GIF
 

BrewingFrog

Was I supposed to type something here?
The Network will want UT. A whole new fanbase to fleece, a new Brand Name to pimp, and a lovely segue into next season's SEC lineup.
 

Wexahu

Full Member
Conference titles give members justification to bump whatever teams they see fit.
Could have easily kept us out last year if they wanted to. We weren't conference champions and we had plenty of less than impressive wins. To be clear, I think we deserved a spot, but I can't believe the "they just pick who will get the best ratings and who they see fit" bit is still a narrative.
 

AroundWorldFrog

Full Member
Bama just needed an absolute miracle to beat a team that got boat raced at home by New Mexico State the week before. Playing better than Texas right now? They might be a 1 or 2 point favorite, but no way that should trump a double digit loss at home,
Yea, but Auburn is notorious for playing to the level of their competition. Bama was their Super Bowl dontcha know? Texas barely ended up beating us. Probably should have lost to K State and Houston except for some bad refs and lousy spots on critical plays. They were tied with Wyoming in the 4th Q. Not a big fan of transitive comparisons.
 

Planks

Active Member
Here’s a question. Say SMU beats #22 Tulane, and say #24 Liberty if Liberty beats New Mexico State (which is not a given). Does SMU leapfrog Liberty for the NY6 spot?
 

Frog-in-law1995

Active Member
Yea, but Auburn is notorious for playing to the level of their competition. Bama was their Super Bowl dontcha know? Texas barely ended up beating us. Probably should have lost to K State and Houston except for some shiddy refs and lousy spots on critical plays. They were tied with Wyoming in the 4th Q. Not a big fan of transitive comparisons.
What about head-to head 10 point losses at home?
 
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