Oh boy..... this is gonna go over REAL well

[Zubaz]

Georgia has won 75% of their games and had eleven 10+ win seasons in the past 15 years. That's the same amount TCU has had and they probably played 50+ more P5 teams during that time period. I really don't get the idea that they've been mired in mediocrity and just recently became good.

It's like when other programs, especially those from other conferences, have an 8-4 or 7-5 year, that means they suck. But when TCU has one it's just discounted as a down year. Do you realize since TCU became a P5 program that the records are 61-20 to 51-27 in favor of Georgia?

No, they weren't going 4-8 or anything, but the last 8 or so years of Richt's tenure in Georgia was the definition of underachieving, hidden behind SEC East inflation. He would go 9-4 / 8-5, occasional ten win season, but would ALWAYS lose the big game. ALWAYS. Think of ANY memorable game that Georgia was in after about 2007 and it's always "Well they almost did something cool". He was like 14-27 against ranked teams, like 4-14 against Top 10 teams. They were losing to TERRIBLE Will Muschamp Florida teams and even worse...they lost to Vanderbilt. 1 major bowl game, a blowout win against Hawaii.

That's not to say anything about the relative strength of Georgia vs TCU, there's no doubt on things like brand, recruiting, NFL players, etc that they probably have an edge, but don't look back on 2008-2015 UGA with any sort of rose colored glasses. There's a reason that Richt got fired.

 

[ShadowFrog]

"What an accomplishment"

THAT is downright Cold!
Next he could do a Guido & have rings on both hands in contemplation stare.

 

[Sebastian S]

Your baseline is that Georgia is a better program, and it’s not debatable.

My response was that it is debatable. And it is.

As I’ve said many times before, you sure pick some strange hills to die on...

I understand he tries to be the voice of reason, looking at it objectively and without purple shades on but tends to overplay the part.

It's a TCU fan message board, of course people will be biased but some have reasonable arguments.

 

[Wexahu]

Your baseline is that Georgia is a better program, and it’s not debatable.

My response was that it is debatable. And it is.

As I’ve said many times before, you sure pick some strange hills to die on...

That wasn't my baseline. It's debatable whether TCU or Georgia has been better, although I don't think most people give UGA enough credit as they should. What's not debatable in my opinion is that, AS A GROUP, LSU/Florida/Auburn/Georgia/Texas A&M/Tennessee are better programs than TCU/Texas/Texas Tech/K-State/West Virginia.

 

[Wexahu]

No, they weren't going 4-8 or anything, but the last 8 or so years of Richt's tenure in Georgia was the definition of underachieving, hidden behind SEC East inflation. He would go 9-4 / 8-5, occasional ten win season, but would ALWAYS lose the big game. ALWAYS. Think of ANY memorable game that Georgia was in after about 2007 and it's always "Well they almost did something cool". He was like 14-27 against ranked teams, like 4-14 against Top 10 teams. They were losing to TERRIBLE Will Muschamp Florida teams and even worse...they lost to Vanderbilt. 1 major bowl game, a blowout win against Hawaii.

That's not to say anything about the relative strength of Georgia vs TCU, there's no doubt on things like brand, recruiting, NFL players, etc that they probably have an edge, but don't look back on 2008-2015 UGA with any sort of rose colored glasses. There's a reason that Richt got fired.

Ok, but we aren't grading on a curve here. I don't know how a team can win 75% of its games over a 15 year period playing an SEC schedule, plus Georgia Tech every year plus another P5 opponent in most years and not be a really good team. That Richt was able to hang around for 15 years shows he did something right. They just got tired of never getting over that next hump, which is basically winning national championships. The bar is really high in some places. That doesn't mean they weren't really good during Richt's time there.

By the way, he was 3-1 against Muschamp. Actually gave UF one of their 2 losses in 2012, probably kept them out of the national title game. He had ten 10-win seasons in 15 years and five 10-win seasons in his last 8 years. SEC East inflation? How do you measure MWC inflation?

 

[dawg]

From those [ "illegitimate Baylor boys" ] on Shaggy... aggy: the joke that just keeps on giving.

 

[Sebastian S]

They just got tired of never getting over that next hump, which is basically winning national championships.

I don't know the numbers but winning your conference is a good start before a national championship.

How many times did they win the conference in 15 years?

I don't think winning the national championship was the next hump, beating the SEC West was.

 

[Zubaz]

Ok, but we aren't grading on a curve here. I don't know how a team can win 75% of its games over a 15 year period playing an SEC schedule, plus Georgia Tech every year plus another P5 opponent in most years and not be a really good team.

I mean, we kinda are grading on a curve, otherwise we'd say Boise State was hands down the greatest program of the last 20 years and nobody is even close. When you beat the teams that you're supposed to beat but ALWAYS lose the big game (most of the time when favored), then you're a good, but not great, team. Nobody is saying that they were bad or anything, but you can't reasonably speak of them in the same breath as the Alabamas, Ohio States, Oklahomas, etc.

That Richt was able to hang around for 15 years shows he did something right. They just got tired of never getting over that next hump, which is basically winning national championships. The bar is really high in some places. That doesn't mean they weren't really good during Richt's time there

By the way, he was 3-1 against Muschamp.

By the way, 5-10 against Florida overall, another example of underpreforming.

Again, they were good. Not denying that, but that's about it. They were not among the elite. Look at the resume. From 2006 until he was fired in 2015, he had 3 division titles, one blowout loss in the SECCG, one close loss, one division title where he didn't go because of tie-breakers. That's not what a talent-rich team is supposed to do in the SEC East. His record against ranked teams was pretty bad, his record against top 10 teams even worse. He consistently lost games that he should have won, of the 32 games he lost his last 8 seasons, they were FAVORED in 20 of them.

SEC East inflation? How do you measure MWC inflation?

If we had Richt's record in the MWC, if most of our years were like 2006 (beat everyone but the Top 2 good teams in the league) or 2007 (same, but also two weird losses and an OOC loss), then you can bet there would have been a TON of distaste for the state of the program.

 

[Despite the odds Frog]

The reason $EC puts the most in the NFL is because they pay the most.

 

[DaCrief]

"What an accomplishment"

I freakin love this. Stealing for replies to all talk from any Texas school from here on out.

 

[Dogfrog]

I’m surprised that he didn’t call the ears “skin listeners”

Gunneresque.

 

[LSU Game Attendee]

I don't know the numbers but winning your conference is a good start before a national championship.

How many times did they win the conference in 15 years?

Who cares? Get out of here with your frog bias - you forget how UGA consistently beat the preseason like a rented mule.

They also had to play 8 games a year in the SEC, a 14 team rolling ball of butcher knives consisting of UGA, 2 LSUs, 2 Floridas, 2 Auburns, and 7 Alabamas.

 

[Zubaz]

And to be clear, from 2001 to 2007, yeah you'd probably consider Georgia to be elite. That was a heck of a run. 2008-2015 is mostly what I am talking about.

 

[RollToad]

I wonder which team Wexahu will defend to the death next...

 

[stadiumfrog]

No, but they are better than K-State, Texas Tech and West Virginia. LSU, Auburn and Georgia are better than Texas. I said "as a whole" meaning as a group that SEC group is better.

Just recently A&M played KState in a bowl game. Probably better argument if you drop the Ags.

 

[Moose Stuff]

I don’t consider Missouri the middle of the SEC, more towards the bottom. If we’re using the fact that UT beat Missouri as some sort of gauge that the Big 12 is almost as good as the SEC, that’s not saying much. The programs like LSU, Georgia, Auburn, Florida, A&M and Tennessee are on a whole superior to Texas Tech, Texas, TCU, Okie State, Kansas State and West Virginia. I’m not sure how that can really be debated.

Just gonna pick out two schools here (there are others I could ask similar questions about)......can you elaborate on exactly how Tennessee is superior to Texas??? Better program? Nope. Better facilities? Nope. Better secondary sports programs? Nope. Better academics? Nope. Better town? Nope. Better state? Nope. Better mascot? Nope. Better shade of orange? Debatable. Where am I wrong?

Edit - I now see your explanation of what you meant when you wrote the original post. Feel free to disregard the above.

 

[Wexahu]

And to be clear, from 2001 to 2007, yeah you'd probably consider Georgia to be elite. That was a heck of a run. 2008-2015 is mostly what I am talking about.

OK, but in that period from 2008-2015 they were 74-32 (70% winning %) with five 10-win seasons. I'm not saying that's elite, or whatever you want to call it. They haven't been as good as they were supposed to be. There clearly were better teams out there than Georgia. But TCU is 51-27 (65%) since joining the Big 12.

I know it's a TCU message board and we're supposed to inflate our accomplishments and rag on everyone else's, but I'm pretty sure when doing these conference comparisons (which is what this thread is about) TCU is put in the "good" column for the Big 12, right? And to say Georgia "just got good" only recently is about as disingenuous as it gets. Sorry, the massive double standards just annoy me. It's like some people are completely oblivious to actual facts.

 

[froginaustin]

Just gonna pick out two schools here (there are others I could ask similar questions about)......can you elaborate on exactly how Tennessee is superior to Texas??? Better program? Nope. Better facilities? Nope. Better secondary sports programs? Nope. Better academics? Nope. Better town? Nope. Better state? Nope. Better mascot? Nope. Better shade of orange? Debatable. Where am I wrong?

Edit - I now see your explanation of what you meant when you wrote the original post. Feel free to disregard the above.

The "explanation" is a walk-back. The man has a future in politics if he is still looking for a career.

Jk -- really.

 

[Zubaz]

OK, but in that period from 2008-2015 they were 74-32 (70% winning %) with five 10-win seasons. I'm not saying that's elite, or whatever you want to call it. They haven't been as good as they were supposed to be. There clearly were better teams out there than Georgia. But TCU is 51-27 (65%) since joining the Big 12.

From 2008 to 2015, Richt had 3 Top 10 finishes, 3 division titles, 0 conference titles, 0 major bowl berths. Since joining the Big 12, so basically half of that same time period, TCU has 3 top 10 finishes, 1 conference title, 1 division title (for lack of a better term), 1 major bowl game and victory. That's without bringing up the two major bowl berths and 3 additional conference titles during the three years prior that you included for Richt's tenure.

Agian, win percentages aren't everything. If you want to be 9-4 or whatever Richt's average worked out to during those last 8 years, then yeah I guess that's fine, but that's under-performing by most measures, ESPECIALLY given the division that he was in.

I know it's a TCU message board and we're supposed to inflate our accomplishments and rag on everyone else's, but I'm pretty sure when doing these conference comparisons (which is what this thread is about) TCU is put in the "good" column for the Big 12, right? And to say Georgia "just got good" only recently is about as disingenuous as it gets.

Nobody said that though. Georgia was really good from 2001 to 2007, decent but underpreforming from 2008-2016, and was really good last year.

 

[Wexahu]

From 2008 to 2015, Richt had 3 Top 10 finishes, 3 division titles, 0 conference titles, 0 major bowl berths. Since joining the Big 12, so basically half of that same time period, TCU has 3 top 10 finishes, 1 conference title, 1 division title (for lack of a better term), 1 major bowl game and victory. That's without bringing up the two major bowl berths and 3 additional conference titles during the three years prior that you included for Richt's tenure.

Agian, win percentages aren't everything. If you want to be 9-4 or whatever Richt's average worked out to during those last 8 years, then yeah I guess that's fine, but that's under-performing by most measures, ESPECIALLY given the division that he was in.


Nobody said that though. Georgia was really good from 2001 to 2007, decent but underpreforming from 2008-2016, and was really good last year.

Sure they did. "Georgia just recently became good" - Sebastian 5.