the challenge of recruiting a quarterback

[Eight]

want to say first and foremost this was not only not proof read (which is the norm for me), but also peer reviewed so it should be showing up in the back of an upcoming copy of the lancet filling space

second, my prayers to max on his health.

i am not going to try to defend sonny cumbie or blame him for the situation tcu finds itself in with the recent events. additionally, if someone wants to discuss the issues in offensive design, player development, the role of the strength and conditioning program, or ponder why some schools just plug in a quarterback and don't seem to miss a beat then go for it.

what i feel fairly confident in typing is something that most of us already know and that is when tcu has gotten good quarterback play they have been competitive in the big 12 and when they haven't it hasn't been very pretty.

again, if someone wants to ponder the why's of all this so be it. i simply was curious why it seemed tcu struggled so much to get consistent play at such a critical position and if other schools struggled to bring in talent in a similar manner. i compared tcu, ou, and texas' recruiting at the quarterback position as well as the transfers from 2010 to 2020. here is what i found:

tcu
2010
matt brown
2011
chatzen gonzales
trevone boykin
2012
austin aune
tyler matthews
2013
zach allen
2014
foster sawyer
grayson muehlstein
bram kohlhausen - tr
2015
kenny hill - tr
2016
brennan wooten
2017
shawn robinson
mike collins
2018
justin rogers
2019
max duggan
matt baldiwn - tr
matt downing - tr
alex delton
2020
eli williams
stephon brown

a number of injuries, misses, and a few transfers for playing time. so how does that compare to the two schools that have consistently gotten their choice for the most part in recruiting

texas
2010
connor wood
case mccoy
2011
david ash
2012
connor brewer
2013
tyrone swoopes
2014
jerrod heard
2015
matthew merrick
2016
shane buechele
2017
sam ehinger
2018
cameron rising
casey thompson
2019
roschon johnson
2020
hudson care
ja'quiden jackson

ash showed promise before concussions ended his career and buechele showed potential until he was replaced by sam, but in large part there are a number of who is that?

ou
2010
blake bell
2011
kendall thompson
2012
trevor knight
2013
cody thomas
2014
justice hansen
baker mayfield - tr
2015
connor mcginnis
2016
austin kendall
kyler murray - tr
2017
chris robison
2018
tanner mordecai
2019
spencer rattler
jalen hurts - tr
2020
chandler morris

not sure if baker lifted the system/ program or the system made baker, but he did pave the way for murray and then hurts. do call [ deposit from a bull that looks like Art Briles ] if you claim to know how some of these guys are / were, don't live in oklahoma, and listen to the sports animal.

interesting that rattler will be the first ou quarterback signee to start since trevor knight

not sure what any of this means other than other schools have missed in their quarterback recruiting. also not sure what it means that since signing shawn robinson the frogs have signed a quarterback from nw lousiana, iowa, oklahoma, a kansas juco, transfer from penn, transfer from georgia, transfer from kansas state, a commit from alabama, and a commit from the gdr.

 

[Eight]

one addition, as i did a quick check of tech's quarterback recruiting over the last 10 years. you would think with the pirate and kliff they would have turned out qb's like a machine right?

texas tech
2010
scotty young
2011
-
2012
clayton nicholas
2013
davis webb
baker mayfield - wo
2014
pat mahomes II
2015
-
2016
jett duffey
2017
xavier martin
mcclain carter - jc
2018
alan bowman
2019
maverick mcivor
jackson tyner - tr
2020
henry colombi - utah st tr

how valuable was pat mahomes to kliff?

 

[Planks]

one addition, as i did a quick check of tech's quarterback recruiting over the last 10 years. you would think with the pirate and kliff they would have turned out qb's like a machine right?

texas tech
2010
scotty young
2011
-
2012
clayton nicholas
2013
davis webb
baker mayfield - wo
2014
pat mahomes II
2015
-
2016
jett duffey
2017
xavier martin
mcclain carter - jc
2018
alan bowman
2019
maverick mcivor
jackson tyner - tr
2020
henry colombi - utah st tr

how valuable was pat mahomes to kliff?

I would certainly count Mayfield and Webb as successes for Tech. And I think arguments could be made for Duffey and Bowman.

Mayfield and Webb left Tech because there were too many good quarterbacks. Yes they didn’t finish their careers with tech, but they did actually start for tech they were good when they did play. That can’t be said for most of the quarterbacks that have been discussed in this thread.

There are probably levels to this. There are guys who are good starters (Kenny Hill), guys who are bad starters (Shawn Robinson), and guys who are not P5 level starters (Wooten, Zach Allen, Muehlstein, etc).

I think you could argue that Case McCoy and Shane B were successes for Texas. Neither one was a star for Texas, but they were at least capable starters. I think our coaches would kill to have them on our team right now.

 

[Armadillo]

wyomingfrog in 3....2....1....to call you a blathering fool.

(for the record, I appreciate your post. I don't appreciate wyomingfrog)

want to say first and foremost this was not only not proof read (which is the norm for me), but also peer reviewed so it should be showing up in the back of an upcoming copy of the lancet filling space

second, my prayers to max on his health.

i am not going to try to defend sonny cumbie or blame him for the situation tcu finds itself in with the recent events. additionally, if someone wants to discuss the issues in offensive design, player development, the role of the strength and conditioning program, or ponder why some schools just plug in a quarterback and don't seem to miss a beat then go for it.

what i feel fairly confident in typing is something that most of us already know and that is when tcu has gotten good quarterback play they have been competitive in the big 12 and when they haven't it hasn't been very pretty.

again, if someone wants to ponder the why's of all this so be it. i simply was curious why it seemed tcu struggled so much to get consistent play at such a critical position and if other schools struggled to bring in talent in a similar manner. i compared tcu, ou, and texas' recruiting at the quarterback position as well as the transfers from 2010 to 2020. here is what i found:

tcu
2010
matt brown
2011
chatzen gonzales
trevone boykin
2012
austin aune
tyler matthews
2013
zach allen
2014
foster sawyer
grayson muehlstein
bram kohlhausen - tr
2015
kenny hill - tr
2016
brennan wooten
2017
shawn robinson
mike collins
2018
justin rogers
2019
max duggan
matt baldiwn - tr
matt downing - tr
alex delton
2020
eli williams
stephon brown

a number of injuries, misses, and a few transfers for playing time. so how does that compare to the two schools that have consistently gotten their choice for the most part in recruiting

texas
2010
connor wood
case mccoy
2011
david ash
2012
connor brewer
2013
tyrone swoopes
2014
jerrod heard
2015
matthew merrick
2016
shane buechele
2017
sam ehinger
2018
cameron rising
casey thompson
2019
roschon johnson
2020
hudson care
ja'quiden jackson

ash showed promise before concussions ended his career and buechele showed potential until he was replaced by sam, but in large part there are a number of who is that?

ou
2010
blake bell
2011
kendall thompson
2012
trevor knight
2013
cody thomas
2014
justice hansen
baker mayfield - tr
2015
connor mcginnis
2016
austin kendall
kyler murray - tr
2017
chris robison
2018
tanner mordecai
2019
spencer rattler
jalen hurts - tr
2020
chandler morris

not sure if baker lifted the system/ program or the system made baker, but he did pave the way for murray and then hurts. do call [ deposit from a bull that looks like Art Briles ] if you claim to know how some of these guys are / were, don't live in oklahoma, and listen to the sports animal.

interesting that rattler will be the first ou quarterback signee to start since trevor knight

not sure what any of this means other than other schools have missed in their quarterback recruiting. also not sure what it means that since signing shawn robinson the frogs have signed a quarterback from nw lousiana, iowa, oklahoma, a kansas juco, transfer from penn, transfer from georgia, transfer from kansas state, a commit from alabama, and a commit from the gdr.

 

[jake102]

Do we really want to be UT?

 

[Wexahu]

I would certainly count Mayfield and Webb as successes for Tech. And I think arguments could be made for Duffey and Bowman.

Mayfield and Webb left Tech because there were too many good quarterbacks. Yes they didn’t finish their careers with tech, but they did actually start for tech they were good when they did play. That can’t be said for most of the quarterbacks that have been discussed in this thread.

There are probably levels to this. There are guys who are good starters (Kenny Hill), guys who are bad starters (Shawn Robinson), and guys who are not P5 level starters (Wooten, Zach Allen, Muehlstein, etc).

I think you could argue that Case McCoy and Shane B were successes for Texas. Neither one was a star for Texas, but they were at least capable starters. I think our coaches would kill to have them on our team right now.

Yeah, our bar is pretty damn low, that's for sure. Just be competent, that's kind of the first step for our QBs, and just that has been too tough a hurdle for way too many of our guys.

 

[AroundWorldFrog]

Yeah, our bar is pretty damn low, that's for sure. Just be competent, that's kind of the first step for our QBs, and just that has been too tough a hurdle for way too many of our guys.

For many of our posters as well. People need to take this in perspective,

 

[Horny4TCU]

I wish we could get Ohio St's 3rd string QB to transfer to TCU... Last time their 3rd stringer played, they won a Natty.

 

[AroundWorldFrog]

I wish we could get Ohio St's 3rd string QB to transfer to TCU... Last time their 3rd stringer played, they won a Natty.

He done playing school tho.

 

[AroundWorldFrog]

Can we get our esteemed attorney, @steelfrog, working on a waiver for Justin Fields? Really seems like a hardship case that tOSU has denied him his final year of college ball and that will result in future lost revenue. Gotta be a legitimate case for an immediate waiver there.

 

[Unspecified]

They key is to recruit, keep, and develop.

The team we do not mention has recruited one QB each class since 2016

2016 Zach Smith (started, lost job to Brewer, transferred)
2017 Charlie Brewer (Sr)
2018 Gerry Bohannon (Jr)
2019 Jacob Zeno (So)
2020 Blake Shapen (Fr)
2021 Kyrone Drones (committed)

Four four stars, two three stars.

Smith transferred out, the rest are stacked behind a four year starter.

That's how you get depth.

 

[Horny4TCU]

He done playing school tho.

We don't need that 3rd stringer... I'm sure their current one is pretty good.

 

[Froggish]

want to say first and foremost this was not only not proof read (which is the norm for me), but also peer reviewed so it should be showing up in the back of an upcoming copy of the lancet filling space

second, my prayers to max on his health.

i am not going to try to defend sonny cumbie or blame him for the situation tcu finds itself in with the recent events. additionally, if someone wants to discuss the issues in offensive design, player development, the role of the strength and conditioning program, or ponder why some schools just plug in a quarterback and don't seem to miss a beat then go for it.

what i feel fairly confident in typing is something that most of us already know and that is when tcu has gotten good quarterback play they have been competitive in the big 12 and when they haven't it hasn't been very pretty.

again, if someone wants to ponder the why's of all this so be it. i simply was curious why it seemed tcu struggled so much to get consistent play at such a critical position and if other schools struggled to bring in talent in a similar manner. i compared tcu, ou, and texas' recruiting at the quarterback position as well as the transfers from 2010 to 2020. here is what i found:

tcu
2010
matt brown
2011
chatzen gonzales
trevone boykin
2012
austin aune
tyler matthews
2013
zach allen
2014
foster sawyer
grayson muehlstein
bram kohlhausen - tr
2015
kenny hill - tr
2016
brennan wooten
2017
shawn robinson
mike collins
2018
justin rogers
2019
max duggan
matt baldiwn - tr
matt downing - tr
alex delton
2020
eli williams
stephon brown

a number of injuries, misses, and a few transfers for playing time. so how does that compare to the two schools that have consistently gotten their choice for the most part in recruiting

texas
2010
connor wood
case mccoy
2011
david ash
2012
connor brewer
2013
tyrone swoopes
2014
jerrod heard
2015
matthew merrick
2016
shane buechele
2017
sam ehinger
2018
cameron rising
casey thompson
2019
roschon johnson
2020
hudson care
ja'quiden jackson

ash showed promise before concussions ended his career and buechele showed potential until he was replaced by sam, but in large part there are a number of who is that?

ou
2010
blake bell
2011
kendall thompson
2012
trevor knight
2013
cody thomas
2014
justice hansen
baker mayfield - tr
2015
connor mcginnis
2016
austin kendall
kyler murray - tr
2017
chris robison
2018
tanner mordecai
2019
spencer rattler
jalen hurts - tr
2020
chandler morris

not sure if baker lifted the system/ program or the system made baker, but he did pave the way for murray and then hurts. do call [ deposit from a bull that looks like Art Briles ] if you claim to know how some of these guys are / were, don't live in oklahoma, and listen to the sports animal.

interesting that rattler will be the first ou quarterback signee to start since trevor knight

not sure what any of this means other than other schools have missed in their quarterback recruiting. also not sure what it means that since signing shawn robinson the frogs have signed a quarterback from nw lousiana, iowa, oklahoma, a kansas juco, transfer from penn, transfer from georgia, transfer from kansas state, a commit from alabama, and a commit from the gdr.

I think finding good QB play is the toughest thing in football. I would however say that judging a program by the number of guys who do or don’t pan out is a pretty flawed way of looking at programs. QB is a one man position so obviously if you bring a QB in every year to compete your going to have a number that don’t work out. There some chicken/egg arguments that could be had in regard to ability and tools vs development and opportunity but IMO to know whether a program recruits and develops QBs well you simply need to look at the production it gets annually. Does that one guy that does hit the field every year produce well? If so, you’re doing a good job. It doesn’t necessarily mean the other QBs in your program were busts. You can’t lose sight of the goal. It to have good QB play every year. That’s successful recruiting and development. The number of bodies is irrelevant

 

[HG73]

Most all QBs that don't start will transfer out, unless they have a clear path to start next year.

 

[Eight]

Can we get our esteemed attorney, @steelfrog, working on a waiver for Justin Fields? Really seems like a hardship case that tOSU has denied him his final year of college ball and that will result in future lost revenue. Gotta be a legitimate case for an immediate waiver there.

fairly certain justin comes with his own legal team, but i am open to steel working pro bono if justin is open to relocating to ft worth for a few months

 

[Eight]

They key is to recruit, keep, and develop.

The team we do not mention has recruited one QB each class since 2016

2016 Zach Smith (started, lost job to Brewer, transferred)
2017 Charlie Brewer (Sr)
2018 Gerry Bohannon (Jr)
2019 Jacob Zeno (So)
2020 Blake Shapen (Fr)
2021 Kyrone Drones (committed)

Four four stars, two three stars.

Smith transferred out, the rest are stacked behind a four year starter.

That's how you get depth.

scheiss off bear boy

 

[AroundWorldFrog]

They key is to recruit, keep, and develop.

The team we do not mention has recruited one QB each class since 2016

2016 Zach Smith (started, lost job to Brewer, transferred)
2017 Charlie Brewer (Sr)
2018 Gerry Bohannon (Jr)
2019 Jacob Zeno (So)
2020 Blake Shapen (Fr)
2021 Kyrone Drones (committed)

Four four stars, two three stars.

Smith transferred out, the rest are stacked behind a four year starter.

That's how you get depth.

Don't forget ignoring concussion protocol. That helps keep your brain dead QBs in play.

 

[Bonner4Prez]

one addition, as i did a quick check of tech's quarterback recruiting over the last 10 years. you would think with the pirate and kliff they would have turned out qb's like a machine right?

texas tech
2010
scotty young
2011
-
2012
clayton nicholas
2013
davis webb
baker mayfield - wo
2014
pat mahomes II
2015
-
2016
jett duffey
2017
xavier martin
mcclain carter - jc
2018
alan bowman
2019
maverick mcivor
jackson tyner - tr
2020
henry colombi - utah st tr

how valuable was pat mahomes to kliff?

You forgot Brewer who went on to start at VTech. Tech recruits them but can't keep them.

 

[Frog DJ]

They key is to recruit, keep, and develop.

In these days of the "transfer portal" the second descriptor seems to be the most important.

Go Frogs!

 

[Eight]

I think finding good QB play is the toughest thing in football. I would however say that judging a program by the number of guys who do or don’t pan out is a pretty flawed way of looking at programs. QB is a one man position so obviously if you bring a QB in every year to compete your going to have a number that don’t work out. There some chicken/egg arguments that could be had in regard to ability and tools vs development and opportunity but IMO to know whether a program recruits and develops QBs well you simply need to look at the production it gets annually. Does that one guy that does hit the field every year produce well? If so, you’re doing a good job. It doesn’t necessarily mean the other QBs in your program were busts. You can’t lose sight of the goal. It to have good QB play every year. That’s successful recruiting and development. The number of bodies is irrelevant

agree and i was listing the overall recruits at the position for the three schools primarily to show that while we think we have burned through a number of recruits at the position that really isn't that uncommon

especially with the offenses being run in college today that depend so much on the quarterback position being able to execute certain things for an offense to be successful.