Frognosticator
Tier 1
Raid the Big XII. It would strengthen the conference, and let OU do what it desperately wants to do - get out of the shadow of UT.
The Big East should take OU and OSU
- Thread starter Frognosticator
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froginaustin
Active Member
:laugh:
BelushiBob
New Member
You know that OU and OSU werent always in the same conference right? If UT keeps acting like a independent then it will likely be independent.
fanatical frog
Full Member
OU still wants changes to the LHN.....UT will refuse. What will OU do then?
Conventional wisdom now has it that OU lost it's leverage when PAC 12 shut out the best and most attractive expansion candidate it will ever see. I don't think so.
The SEC would take OU in a heart beat......but OU won't go without OSU. So what will OU do then.
If OU doesn't get what they..... and the rest of the conference want from UT, they will have the BEast option....and they could take as many as six of their closest six friends if they want to....leaving Texas behind.
I'm not holding my breath, but crazier things have happened within the last week already.
While were at it, we should offer Florida, Alabama, Ohio St, Michigan, Penn St, Notre Dame and go to 16!
:wink:
Frognosticator
Tier 1
The others can laugh, but this is exactly what I was thinking. OU got caught without options. We can offer them an option, along with KU, KSU and even ISU.
Then let Texas, Tech and Baylor recruit BYU, SMU, Houston, UTEP, maybe even North Texas and Highland Park HS for the Big XII.
fanatical frog
Full Member
Actually, considering that OSU will go where ever OU goes, if those two go anywhere the Bevo conference is either dead or irrelevant.
OU could probably bring their choice of current B12 schools with them to the BEast and create a stronger conference than the one they'd be leaving ......and have the entire EAST COAST media promoting them.
I hope Mr. Boren considers it.
fanatical frog
Full Member
MT....your sarcasm is out of character and misplaced.
The BEast option gives OU/OSU an opportunity to extricate themselves from a bad situation that will only get worse. At the same time, it would give them to opportunity to design a fantastic conference.
And....it would destroy the B12 because others in the conference would (or should) want on board that train on a one way trip out of Bevo land.
HFrog1999
Member
The last thing the Big East should do is think or act small time. I don't understand those of you who think that the Big East (or TCU for that matter) should restrict themselves to small time scenarios. They should at least be talking to the Big 12 schools. We know that last year the Kansas schools were talking to the Big East.
It may be a long shot, but the Big East gives schools that are unhappy with their current situation an AQ conference. If the Oklahoma and or Kansas Schools went to the Big East it would suddenly transform the conference into a bigger player. Also, those schools would finally control their own destinies instead of drinking down stream from Bevo.
Thinking Small Time doesn't help anyone.
It may be a long shot, but the Big East gives schools that are unhappy with their current situation an AQ conference. If the Oklahoma and or Kansas Schools went to the Big East it would suddenly transform the conference into a bigger player. Also, those schools would finally control their own destinies instead of drinking down stream from Bevo.
Thinking Small Time doesn't help anyone.
joejordan
Member
The BE wet dream would be to pull OU/OSU and KU/KSU out from under 13-0. That would leave Taxes with Mizzery, ISuckU, sand aggie, and the green and brown butthole of Texas - Waco. I;m sure they would move to bring in BYU, Boise St, SMU, Rice and either Colorado State or Coogie. And guess what? Taxes conference would be stronger and more appealing than the slicksters in the BE, even with OU.
We should hope for a semblance of stability at this point, as Taxes needs time to develop their net, so they can go Indy (good riddance - let them go-they'll be successful no matter what), then all the moons that revolve around Taxes can re-orient themselves into a reasonable, competitive, geographically appealing conference. It also gives us a couple seasons to do well in the BE (we have a young, talented team and a pretty good coach) and raise our national profile for the coming shuffle.
We should hope for a semblance of stability at this point, as Taxes needs time to develop their net, so they can go Indy (good riddance - let them go-they'll be successful no matter what), then all the moons that revolve around Taxes can re-orient themselves into a reasonable, competitive, geographically appealing conference. It also gives us a couple seasons to do well in the BE (we have a young, talented team and a pretty good coach) and raise our national profile for the coming shuffle.
PurplePutt
Active Member
I can't hear the laughter all the way from Norman and Stoolwater!
froginaustin
Active Member
I once thought OU could go wherever they pleased, but in today's climate who knows.
A coincidence the SEC is still at 13? I presume they are, anyway. I haven't noticed anything about Mizzou or any of the other usual suspects for the SEC#14 jumping over.
If OU shed UTx, is the PAC still a "no" for them?
I suppose moving to the BE would be better for OU than starting a conference from scratch, but maybe only barely. It's hard to see OU moving there, or to any non-AQ conference.
I hope that I am wrong (again, on conference realignment stuff) and that the OP is right, but the OP still doesn't appear to pass the sober comment test.
A coincidence the SEC is still at 13? I presume they are, anyway. I haven't noticed anything about Mizzou or any of the other usual suspects for the SEC#14 jumping over.
If OU shed UTx, is the PAC still a "no" for them?
I suppose moving to the BE would be better for OU than starting a conference from scratch, but maybe only barely. It's hard to see OU moving there, or to any non-AQ conference.
I hope that I am wrong (again, on conference realignment stuff) and that the OP is right, but the OP still doesn't appear to pass the sober comment test.
Maybe a bit much...feeling feisty, but this would never happen...EVER. OU says they dont like Texas yet every time they have the chance to leave, they dont. Simple fact is, the two together make too much cash.
THeir Bill and Hillary Clinton, they dont like each other but together their powerfull. Also, OU and their fans have been caling us the Big Least for decades. They cant join and appear to be going to a weak conference.
fanatical frog
Full Member
I'm 100% certain that nothing is 100% certain. Never say never.
Obviously, OU's first and second priority is to preserve the B12-2-1 conference. Just saying....if Dodds back's Boren into a corner will he fold his tent.....or check for options.
BTW....and I am 100% certain I shouldn't bring this up while you're feeling feisty............but.......the following numbers are straight from University of Houston Athletic Dept website:
2009 Attendance Numbers:
vs Rice...........28,243 (Rice University is about ten miles from UH)
vs Memphis......22,036
vs. Southern Miss.....20,125
vs. SMU.....26,889 (four hour drive from SMU)
Average for those four games.......24,323
I'm glad I looked those numbers up because it's probably 10% higher than I would have expected......UH is making real progress....but those are the attendance #'s most of us are used to seeing at Houston.
Most TCU fans would be ecstatic to have a conference mate within four hours drive so we don't bag on Houston just to be mean....we just don't believe Houston area fans will support that program. I wish it wouldn't be the case.....but it just is.
Maybe (hopefully) Houston will have continued or even accelerated success and the city will notice....when and if that happens frog fans will be first to endorse them.
You cited their numbers for 2010.......I don't recall the details but UH offered "deals" on tickets....something along the lines of "Buy $20 worth of groceries and get a ticket to a UH game"......not to be critical of that type of promotion, but it kind of inflated their attendance numbers for last year.
Again, I think most frog fans want UH to succeed....and we can have a conference game we can drive to. We'll see.
yep, that was 2009...now go look up 2010. They averaged 31, 728...out of 32,000.
http://blog.philsteele.com/2011/04/06/2010-homeaway-average-attendance/
If you compare to UCF, they are about the same. UCF averaged in the low 20s before building their stadium. I wouldnt doubt at all that Houston could fill a 40K seat stadium. Add in a Big East invite with the AQ, and 45K isnt out of the realm of possibility.
Also, success builds on success. Houstons basketball isnt bad but they just got two amazing players to commit. I expect them to win CUSA very soon and do well in the Tourney. That will create more T-shirt fans, which does translate to football fans also.
Either way, UCF isnt getting in and I have a real issue with them. Why would we let in a team that had to cheat TWICE to get where they are at. Take away the fact that I hate their fans...they got to a level of succes by being cheaters. I hate that. USF started out 14 years ago and did things the right way and were just now favored to win the BE. UCF was jealous of us and did anything and everything to win...including abusing a player, killing a player, and getting caught cheating twice.
Truth is that UCF needs the BE invite because they are in a financial hard place. They overspent on facilities thinking it would defitnitely get them into an AQ conference but when they went cheap and all their stuff looks like fake chrome, people werent that impressed. Watch their fan attendance after this weekend. They lost to FIU, their going to lose to BYU and after a few losses, you will see alot of empty seats in those stands.
http://blog.philsteele.com/2011/04/06/2010-homeaway-average-attendance/
If you compare to UCF, they are about the same. UCF averaged in the low 20s before building their stadium. I wouldnt doubt at all that Houston could fill a 40K seat stadium. Add in a Big East invite with the AQ, and 45K isnt out of the realm of possibility.
Also, success builds on success. Houstons basketball isnt bad but they just got two amazing players to commit. I expect them to win CUSA very soon and do well in the Tourney. That will create more T-shirt fans, which does translate to football fans also.
Either way, UCF isnt getting in and I have a real issue with them. Why would we let in a team that had to cheat TWICE to get where they are at. Take away the fact that I hate their fans...they got to a level of succes by being cheaters. I hate that. USF started out 14 years ago and did things the right way and were just now favored to win the BE. UCF was jealous of us and did anything and everything to win...including abusing a player, killing a player, and getting caught cheating twice.
Truth is that UCF needs the BE invite because they are in a financial hard place. They overspent on facilities thinking it would defitnitely get them into an AQ conference but when they went cheap and all their stuff looks like fake chrome, people werent that impressed. Watch their fan attendance after this weekend. They lost to FIU, their going to lose to BYU and after a few losses, you will see alot of empty seats in those stands.
fanatical frog
Full Member
I did look at 2010 and I even pointed out to you that UH had to get creative to get that many people into the stadium. We have local knowledge of UH just like you have local knowledge of UCF.
We'd prefer not to have Houston for all the same reasons you'd prefer not to have UCF and all the arguments in favor of or in opposition to one can be made for or against the other.
Either way, they're both marginal candidates and we need something better than either of them.
I appreciate your passion for the conference and I enjoy reading your comments, but I wish you'd stop trying to force UH on us.
I am not trying to force UH on anybody. People state their opinions and I state mine. You agree with theirs, so its not annoying to you...but my opinion is. Take it with a grain of salt, I am not the BE commisioner.
For all the reasons that you dont like UH and all the reasons I dont like UCF, there is still some outstanding items that no person can disagree... UHs has a market twice the size of UCFs.
I like the idea of expanding west because I am still not convinced that long term the B12 will survive. Adding Air Force and Houston starts to make a western division and if or when the time comes, we can pick up the B12 pieces. Also, all the BE already recruits Florida... a second Texas presence would be good for us.
*** with that said, can we agree on Navy, Air Force and ECU as football only members? Id like to see it get done asap, then double the exit fee for Pitt and Cuse if they want to leave immediately***
For all the reasons that you dont like UH and all the reasons I dont like UCF, there is still some outstanding items that no person can disagree... UHs has a market twice the size of UCFs.
I like the idea of expanding west because I am still not convinced that long term the B12 will survive. Adding Air Force and Houston starts to make a western division and if or when the time comes, we can pick up the B12 pieces. Also, all the BE already recruits Florida... a second Texas presence would be good for us.
*** with that said, can we agree on Navy, Air Force and ECU as football only members? Id like to see it get done asap, then double the exit fee for Pitt and Cuse if they want to leave immediately***
fanatical frog
Full Member
Pitt and Cuse knew and understood the exit clause when they made their decision. I hope Marinatto has (for once) the balls to enforce it as he said he would.
I've suggested a western division for months and I see it as necessary for survival....Air Force is a good start but there are only two others out west that actually help. BYU will now have a B12 option (which is why we should have invited them months ago) and it now appears they might not want to be in any BCS conference. Boise is the other and I have no idea if they'd be interested I just think they're one of the only ones who gives us anything we need. But if, by some miracle, we could get Brigham Young and Boise along with Air Force we could add Houston and one other and have a dandy little western division of six teams....so that eastern division teams only travel west once every four years.
Well, I like the idea of getting more money out of Pitt and Cuse in order for them to leave early, but one thing people are not remebering is that both of them are voting members until the day they leave.
They can join up with the basketball schools to block any teams we want. Lets say we decide we want ECU. It would be a very close vote to get them in and if Pitt and Cuse team up...they block it. We could essentially have the football teams be dictated to as to who we invite if we dont get rid of them.
They can join up with the basketball schools to block any teams we want. Lets say we decide we want ECU. It would be a very close vote to get them in and if Pitt and Cuse team up...they block it. We could essentially have the football teams be dictated to as to who we invite if we dont get rid of them.
fanatical frog
Full Member
I don't get to spend any money the conference get's from Pitt and Cuse so I don't care at all about the money. I just want the conference to have at least nine members for at least two years.....and I want a shot at both Pitt and Cuse at Amon Carter stadium just to see if Coach Patterson will run up the score on them.
Let 'em vote.....they only get one vote each....they lose every vote by seven to two. On the off chance they can block anything while they still get a vote we can correct it after they leave. BTW, IIRC....I think all of Utah, BYU and TCU all declined to vote on ongoing issues after we announced leaving the MWC.
BTW.... I understand you're not trying to force UH on us and I'm not annoyed when it's brought up like ......for maybe the 100th time.....just nobody here care's how big the tv market is in Houston....we just don't want them. Please let that one slide.
