• The KillerFrogs

Big 12 Thrives While PAC Nose Dives

Limey Frog

Limey Frog

Full Member
Prince of Purpoole II said:
www.heartlandcollegesports.com

The Big 12 Thrives While the Pac-12 Nose Dives

Another day that goes by in the college football world means another day without a media rights deal for the Pac-12 Conference. The conference of champions (try saying that out loud without laughing) is still sitting there twiddling their thumbs hoping for someone to save them. And no matter how...
www.heartlandcollegesports.com www.heartlandcollegesports.com
Click to expand...
The last five minutes of this podcast is illuminating:




I saw it referenced elsewhere and gave it a quick listen as it was only a short segment in a podcast I would otherwise not care about (pro sports media talk). Basically these guys (who appear to be pretty well connected in the industry) said the following:

--The over-the-air broadcasters are out (i.e., Pac 12 won't be on ABC, Fox, CBS, NBC).
--Amazon only wants one game per week, and would want first pick.
--ESPN would also want first pick, and wants the 'After Dark' slot for the game of the week. The rest would be put on ESPN+.
--Yormark jumping the shark on the Big XII's deal took most of the remaining linear TV money and time slots that were left in the market off the table: that was a zero-sum game and Yormark won.
--AppleTV is a possibility for the Pac, but they would also want the game that the Pac needs to sell to ESPN.
--Neither Apple nor Amazon is going to pay significantly more for these rights than ESPN or Fox would (i.e., streaming services are not some untapped source of revenue in market-changing scale).

Basically you're at a point where no realistically possible outcome for the Pac is especially good and several that are very bad remain possible.
 
Last edited:
M

MAcFroggy

Active Member
The PAC-12 might find a way to miraculously make more money than the Big 12 via streaming or something, but I am more than willing to have a gap in revenue, if it means the Big 12 is on Fox, ABC, ESPN/2/U, and FS1 and the Pac 12 is not. The contract is great from a branding standpoint. Athletics can't be the "front porch of the university" if the games are all on streaming platforms or on at 10 PM at night.
 
Hemingway

Hemingway

Active Member
Limey Frog said:
The last five minutes of this podcast is illuminating:




I saw it referenced elsewhere and gave it a quick listen as it was only a short segment in a podcast I would otherwise not care about (pro sports media talk). Basically these guys (who appear to be pretty well connected in the industry) said the following:

--The over-the-air broadcasters are out (i.e., Pac 12 won't be on ABC, Fox, CBS, NBC).
--Amazon only wants one game per week, and would want first pick.
--ESPN would also want first pick, and wants the 'After Dark' slot for the game of the week. The rest would be put on ESPN+.
--Yormark jumping the shark on the Big XII's deal took most of the remaining linear TV money and time slots that were left in the market off the table: that was a zero-sum game and Yormark won.
--AppleTV is a possibility for the Pac, but they would also want the game that the Pac needs to sell to ESPN.
--Neither Apple nor Amazon is going to pay significantly more for these rights than ESPN or Fox would (i.e., streaming services are not some untapped source of revenue in market-changing scale).

Basically you're at a point where no realistically possible outcome for the Pac is especially good and several that are very bad remain possible.
Click to expand...

And then they need UW and UO to sign a ten year + GOR , which ain’t happening because they have big 10 dreams.
 
East Coast

East Coast

Tier 1
Limey Frog said:
The last five minutes of this podcast is illuminating:




I saw it referenced elsewhere and gave it a quick listen as it was only a short segment in a podcast I would otherwise not care about (pro sports media talk). Basically these guys (who appear to be pretty well connected in the industry) said the following:

--The over-the-air broadcasters are out (i.e., Pac 12 won't be on ABC, Fox, CBS, NBC).
--Amazon only wants one game per week, and would want first pick.
--ESPN would also want first pick, and wants the 'After Dark' slot for the game of the week. The rest would be put on ESPN+.
--Yormark jumping the shark on the Big XII's deal took most of the remaining linear TV money and time slots that were left in the market off the table: that was a zero-sum game and Yormark won.
--AppleTV is a possibility for the Pac, but they would also want the game that the Pac needs to sell to ESPN.
--Neither Apple nor Amazon is going to pay significantly more for these rights than ESPN or Fox would (i.e., streaming services are not some untapped source of revenue in market-changing scale).

Basically you're at a point where no realistically possible outcome for the Pac is especially good and several that are very bad remain possible.
Click to expand...

Jeez, if that is a true reflection of how bad it is for the PAC, they are looking at $100 - $120 million total even with adding 2 teams. Every single one of the current teams would jump to the Big12 if they could in that scenario, even Stanford and Cal.
 
Limey Frog

Limey Frog

Full Member
East Coast said:
Jeez, if that is a true reflection of how bad it is for the PAC, they are looking at $100 - $120 million total even with adding 2 teams. Every single one of the current teams would jump to the Big12 if they could in that scenario, even Stanford and Cal.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I still have a hard time believe that it's this bad. As I've said before, I'll believe anyone leaving the Pac for the Big 12 prior to Oregon bolting for the Big Ten only when I see it happen. That said, ADs letting The Athletic anonymously quote them as saying things are bad, the Pac's weird statement of solidarity on Monday, and Kliavkoff being seen at a SMU basketball game are all very unusual for this sort of thing. Important parties are certainly acting in ways that suggest things are desperate. (I mean, you're adding SMU to your league; things are bad.)
 
WhatTheFrog

WhatTheFrog

Active Member
East Coast said:
Jeez, if that is a true reflection of how bad it is for the PAC, they are looking at $100 - $120 million total even with adding 2 teams. Every single one of the current teams would jump to the Big12 if they could in that scenario, even Stanford and Cal.
Click to expand...
Does CA still have the prohibition on state employees travelling to TX? That state and their schools can consume a satchel of richards. I'm not all that fired up about CO either, they've bailed on a good arrangement before and I believe have talked down on the B12 recently. They don't deserve a bailout, though I believe they will get one.
 
Hemingway

Hemingway

Active Member
Who the bleep thought the Pac commish ( a former casino pit boss) was going to out hustle a former music exec that worked with Jay z( Yorkmark)?
big black headshake GIF
 
BrewingFrog

BrewingFrog

Was I supposed to type something here?
Kliavkoff has been frantically bloviating all sorts of nonsense, and with increasing desperation trying to hold things together. With the revelations of the above-linked podcast, which aren't that surprising and are what many have surmised already, the situation looks bleak for the PAC. The various ADs at these Programs know more than what the podcasters are saying, and know that Kliavkoff is full of crap. There isn't a Great Deal coming for them, and they know it. The Streamers are unacceptable, and the Usual Networks aren't going to pay.

Yormark's phone is likely ringing off the hook, 24/7.
 
B

bronco

Active Member
I know the Pac has been screwed by an "Alliance" but this seems like a good time for the Pac, ACC, and B12 to get together and regionalize these three conferences into two conferences. Oregon and Wash are more than likely gone so lets put the remaining pieces into something that works before the Pac elevates more G5 programs to P5.

The Power5 does not need to add any more programs. I wish the Pac would have come to the table with B12 before UCF, Cinci, and UH were elevated.
 
Big Frog II

Big Frog II

Active Member
bronco said:
I know the Pac has been screwed by an "Alliance" but this seems like a good time for the Pac, ACC, and B12 to get together and regionalize these three conferences into two conferences. Oregon and Wash are more than likely gone so lets put the remaining pieces into something that works before the Pac elevates more G5 programs to P5.

The Power5 does not need to add any more programs. I wish the Pac would have come to the table with B12 before UCF, Cinci, and UH were elevated.
Click to expand...
They didn't know USC and UCLA were leaving. Imagine trying to save your conference with SDSU, SMU, UNLV, and/or Fresno. Ouch!
 
Eight

Eight

Member
bronco said:
I know the Pac has been screwed by an "Alliance" but this seems like a good time for the Pac, ACC, and B12 to get together and regionalize these three conferences into two conferences. Oregon and Wash are more than likely gone so lets put the remaining pieces into something that works before the Pac elevates more G5 programs to P5.

The Power5 does not need to add any more programs. I wish the Pac would have come to the table with B12 before UCF, Cinci, and UH were elevated.
Click to expand...

shouldn't that be before ucf, uh, cinci, AND byu were elevated?

the acc is already a massive conference and adding wvu, ucf, and/or cinci does nothing for them

as far as the pac the issue for them is what has been the same for years

their leaders are living in the past and would rather their athletic departments operate under the pretense of amateur athletics and not openly admit they want to try to win
 
Traveling Frog

Traveling Frog

Active Member
Eight said:
shouldn't that be before ucf, uh, cinci, AND byu were elevated?

the acc is already a massive conference and adding wvu, ucf, and/or cinci does nothing for them

as far as the pac the issue for them is what has been the same for years

their leaders are living in the past and would rather their athletic departments operate under the pretense of amateur athletics and not openly admit they want to try to win
Click to expand...
I could still see some type of merger between the ACC BIG 12 and pac I the future where the bottom of each of those conferences are left out. That is the only way to get a conference close to the the Big10 and SEC revenue. Coast to coast with Clemson, Florida state, Oregon, TCU, Washington, Utah, Oklahoma state, Kansas or Kansas state, North Carolina, Miami, sounds like a pretty good top of conference.
 
Limey Frog

Limey Frog

Full Member
Traveling Frog said:
I could still see some type of merger between the ACC BIG 12 and pac I the future where the bottom of each of those conferences are left out. That is the only way to get a conference close to the the Big10 and SEC revenue. Coast to coast with Clemson, Florida state, Oregon, TCU, Washington, Utah, Oklahoma state, Kansas or Kansas state, North Carolina, Miami, sounds like a pretty good top of conference.
Click to expand...
I think you're eventually (circa 2030) looking at around four current members of each of the ACC and Pac ending up in the Big 12(20-ish), while the biggest brands/state R1 institutions (Oregon, Washington, UNC, Virginia, FSU, Clemson, etc.) go to the Big Ten and SEC.

But predicting these things is always a fool's errand and usually descends very quickly into tedious self-publication of fantastical maps. What you can say for certain is:

1. The evolution of the college sports landscape will continue apace; it is far from finished.
2. The Big Ten and SEC will be fine, every other conference has many reasons to worry and could be left behind. No conference, and very few individual schools, outside of those two leagues is/are safe for sure.
3. The Big 12 needs to win the struggle to be in the best position behind those two leagues for right now. This isn't necessarily a death-struggle/cage match vs. the Pac and/or ACC right now, but it might become that at any moment and we need to be ready.
4. We have to monitor the landscape continually, be nimble and take nothing for granted.

A lot can change. The Big 12's reversal of fortunes since 2021 has been remarkable, but it could swing back the other way in a hurry. For right now, I'd say Yormark has been a very good hire. Maybe it's him, maybe it's the institutions he represents, maybe it's both... but I think Kliavkoff has played a weak hand disastrously so far. He may have a pair of aces he's about to show, but it sure feels like he's an arrogant clown who got caught out by putting his faith in California politics. He was pickpocketed while looking the other way, now he's trying to bluff his way out of a very tight spot.
 
Last edited:

Latest posts

Top