TCU Basketball @ Western Virginia Game thread

Discussion in 'Scott Nix Frog Fan Forum' started by Sebastian S, Feb 12, 2018.

  1. Olden
     
  2. Duly noted.
     
  3. Question. Hamdy in my opinion has declined in his play in conference and his last few games his minutes have been limited.

    It’s too late in the year, but any reason we did not pull Samuel’s redshirt at start of the year. Seems like his size and supposed post presence on defense would be welcomed? Thoughts?

    With us over on scholly’s for next year, is RJ gone? Or do we lose one of the big kids like Barlow?
     
  4. I have to assume the coaches don't think he is ready. Plus, they may be thinking the risk reward ratio is simply better for him to redshirt for future teams. They staggering of talent with their recruiting prowess may mean it is worth it to keep the redshirt especially now as we enter late into the season.

    At the end of the day, the coaches will have seen him perform in practice and know what he can and can't do. My experience is that usually coaches make the right decisions on these things more often than not. But I will speculate if we had a hot shot freshman guard redshirting, I suspect we would have pulled his redshirt at some point this season.
     
  5. kevin wasn't cleared by the ncaa academically until dec. 17th.

    https://www.frogsowar.com/2017/12/15/16780938/kevin-samuel-cleared-to-join-tcu-basketball

    before anyone get's pissed about the ncaa dragging their feet there were a few circumstances that made the process drag on a bit.

    first, kevin was homeschooled in houston and i have been told the ncaa has been much more thorough on reviewing those transcripts than from an accredited school. not to take this down a political of social rabbit hole for or against home schooling compared to public schools etc... there are multiple cases of people setting up schools (i.e prime prep) or home school curriculum and it not meeting academic standards.

    houston rocket gerald green supposedly attended a school that had a physical address listed in a strip mall off west belfort so this is a known problem for getting kids qualified.

    i don't know kevin's entire back story, but he is originally from barbuda and i don't think he was home schooled in houston the entire time of his high school academic career. there was a need for his transcripts from his school in barbuda and there was a small glitch in getting those transcripts, hurricane irma.

    here is picture of kevin's home town after irma passed through and it is my understanding his former school did not fair much better.

    [​IMG]

    don't believe kevin could practice with the team until he was given the go ahead in december and since that time has been playing catch-up in regards to conditioning and just basketball

    if i am wrong on any of these anyone feel free to correct
     
  6. College basketball is a completely different animal when you consider my grandfather played in the 1930s when there was a jump ball after EVERY basket.
     
    Eight likes this.
  7. Just about every turnover I watched us commit should have been a foul on WV. How long ago were they exempted from playing by the same rules as everyone else? I don't really know what it is, but it's not basketball. The amount of contact they get away with is more comparable to hand-to-hand combat.
     
  8. #148 Mountaineerlegion, Feb 13, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2018
    Obviously every single ref who's ever called a WVU game is in the bag for us. Congrats to your guys for playing a nearly perfect turnover free game but for our fouls that the NCAA and Big 12 leadership ordered the refs not call because they too are in the bag for us. That's got to be it.
     
  9. Well Oklahoma State managed to deal with it just fine.
     
  10. Hold up. That's [ deposit from a bull that looks like Art Briles ].

    It is objective that games that include a press/trap heavy defense (or two) are officiated differently - and that does work both ways - I know the WVU home crowd was annoyed at some no calls yesterday. In less physical matchups, things are called fouls which are not fouls in a game like last night. This is something that I feel cannot be argued.

    What we CAN do though is have an intellectually honest discussion about whether it is ok for it to be this way. I think it is personally. I hate touch fouls. I say "let em play" far more often than "where's the foul?"

    Discussing the merits of this phenomenon is fine. Denying the phenomenon even exists is ridiculous.
     
  11. satis1103,

    Most of what you said I agree with completely. Your second, and third paragraphs and first sentence of your last paragraph seem indisputable. As for calling my post bull droppings and claiming I'm denying the phenomenon, I think you failed to take my post in context.

    My issue with his post is it's exactly the opposite of the phenomenon you accurately described.

    Bonner4Prez said, "Just about every turnover I watched us commit should have been a foul on WV." We turnover opponents 17.8 times per game, good for #3 in the country. You all though would have had one or two turnovers for the entire game but for our cheating and the refs letting us get away with it. That seems unequivocal and doesn't seem to leave room for nuances in officiating

    Bonner4Prez said, "How long ago were they exempted from playing by the same rules as everyone else?" He's clearly stating we violate the rules but get away with it and have for some time. He didn't say the refs called the game tight or loose as in the phenomenon you described. Additionally, since it's been going on for some time there must have been numerous officiating crews who allow us to violate the rules. Thus my conspiracy sarcasm.

    I'll gladly have an intellectually honest discussion. I was a small time college baseball pitcher. Every home plate umpire called the strike zone differently. I had an umpire who was giving me a little extra plate low and away. I lived there, used it all day. Conversely, one day I was complaining to my catcher about an umpire who was really squeezing me. My 150yr old coach came over and told me if I wanted I could head back to the lockers to see if I could find the umpire I wanted or I could quit complaining and do whatever it took to get guys out. Was I cheating in the first case? Obviously not, you play to the limits of what the refs will give you. When the refs aren't calling as you would like...suck it up buttercup.

    As an aside, with all the whining from our new conference mates about how physical we are, you all would not have liked the BE when we were there.

    Thoughts?
     
  12. TLDR
     
  13. We all read at our own levels. I don't judge, peace brotha.
     
  14. I took your post as an attempt at sarcasm or humor but that's just me, maybe I missed something.
     
  15. If we shoot like we had been shooting that game is a lot closer. If Miller isn’t called for a bogus offensive foul we are only down 5 with 3 minutes left. If we have Olden at the least we have a better chance not to get gassed. We didn’t play well. Having 7 players for the 2nd game in three days wasn’t ideal
     
    netty2424 likes this.
  16. I think we don't disagree on most points.

    I don't like the whining myself either. My preference would be that TCU sucks it up, adjusts to the game and plays a helluva lot more physical in response. We and any other Mountaineer opponent can get away with a lot more contact busting through traps, or grabbing the ball away on D in a game like that. That's not limited to players wearing a WVU jersey.

    The only thing I don't see the need to waste time arguing is whether some of the contact described fits the definition of a foul. In many cases it does - letter of the law - which is not always the most practical perspective. And it's fine if it's a no call in this game, understandable. But we've also watched our team get torched by the likes of Trae Young and we've seen the phantom fouls that get called when you're against skill guys like that. As a fan, it's frustrating to have to bounce back and forth between expectations of officiating.
     
    netty2424 likes this.
  17. WVU presents a tough challenge for officials. If WV is playing their aggressive full court press for 40 minutes and the opponent is not, WV should average committing double the fouls of the opponent assuming officials are calling it exactly the same both ways. Problem is they don’t because in Morgantown they would not get out of town alive if they foul out the starting 5 in the first half. In the FW game WV committed 10 more fouls than TCU. In Morgantown they committed 2 more.

    I’m not complaining, just pointing out that officials choose to moderate their rate of foul calling with pressing teams. It is an advantage pressing teams have always enjoyed and part of coaching strategy.
     
    netty2424 likes this.
  18. All good, we will beat them in KC
     

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