Houston Chronicle: Texas, Oklahoma reach out to SEC about joining conference

[Gary's Shirtless Revenge]

Nice effort. Kinda feel like Cincy is #1 though- pretty much checks all boxes.

Smaller school than people realize when you sort down to the core enrollment.

Cincy media market is ranked 36th nationally, and 6th best on this list comparitively.

For as good as they have been recently, they spend relatively nothing on athletics and football especially. Really disappointing levels of investment in CFB.

Good news: They are pretty good on the field, have a solid following and brand, bring a solid state to the conference (kinda), and contribute well in CBB too. Their TV rating data is OK, middle of the pack, and they REALLY benefit from being ranked and competitive.

I like Cincy, but the data tells me they aren't as much a slam dunk as I thought.

 

[KillerFrog InD KitchenSink]

Smaller school than people realize when you sort down to the core enrollment.

Cincy media market is ranked 36th nationally, and 6th best on this list comparitively.

For as good as they have been recently, they spend relatively nothing on athletics and football especially. Really disappointing levels of investment in CFB.

Good news: They are pretty good on the field, have a solid following and brand, bring a solid state to the conference (kinda), and contribute well in CBB too. Their TV rating data is OK, middle of the pack, and they REALLY benefit from being ranked and competitive.

I like Cincy, but the data tells me they aren't as much a slam dunk as I thought.

Pretty much agree, but I just think they have no big negatives, a few big positives, the biggest being a geographic link with WVU.

 

[TCU Vagabond]

I mean its ridiculous but that schedule actually makes sense.

I was shocked reading it, what’s the weirdest annual matchup in that group, maybe Mississippi State-South Carolina?

That tweet made it seem a lot more logical than it sounds on paper

 

[Peacefrog]

Kind of surprised how well the scheduling fits in something like this. Not getting hopes up, but definitely something to follow

I don’t know anything about anything but I imagine some non Texas schools would want more Texas games. Having the Texas schools all play each other every year doesn’t give other schools a chance to play in Texas and doesn’t bring as many markets into play. Again, I don’t know anything about anything.

 

[TCU Vagabond]

I don’t know anything about anything but I imagine some non Texas schools would want more Texas games. Having the Texas schools all play each other every year doesn’t give other schools a chance to play in Texas and doesn’t bring as many markets into play. Again, I don’t know anything about anything.

If I understand it right, they’d be playing 2-3 TX schools a year due to the rotating nature of the 14 member part of the schedule, which would guarantee each team at lease 1 game in TX a year. I’m sure they could force any of the 4 additions to play a neutral site game a year in various TX locations

 

[watchoutforthelizard]

GSR's Power Ranking of Big 8 Expansion Candidates (new league starts in 2024 or 2025):

1. BYU (football only)
2. UCF
3. Cincinnati
4. Boise State (football only)
5. Houston
6. USF
7. Memphis
8. SMU
9. Colorado State
10. East Carolina

These are power ranked based on a weighted average ranking of the following criteria: local undergrad enrollment, living alumni, local metro, closest major metro (top 50, within 100 miles only), current athletic expenditures in athletics and football excluding student aid (tuition) costs, win % over the last 10 seasons, USNWR university ranking, stadium capacity, non-duplicated average total viewership per game in the past three seasons (excl 2020) adj. for the platform and HH deflation, non-duplicated average prime demo viewership per game in the past three seasons (excl 2020) adj. for the platform and HH deflation. Final adjustment is to prioritize geographic spread, but no more than +/- 1 spot.

You seem well informed enough and I am grateful for your insider information/industry expertise on the whole being relegated to kids table thing. That list though is just awful. It’s the college football version of island of misfit toys. Outside of BYU there is no program that provides any credibility. Sure Boise was media sweetheart in the BCS Buster days but that has faded and they are still a glorified junior college of an academic institution. How the mighty have fallen for those 8 unlucky enough to be left behind. I’d hate to be responsible for selling ticket packages to watch that sad sack list of potential candidates.

 

[DeuceBoogieNights]

Not in my book. Fort Collins is in the middle of nowhere and saying CSU delivers the Denver market is just inaccurate.

They also aren't THAT big of a school comparatively, don't spend enough on athletics, poor following (bad, bad ratings), and have this essential problem of not being good at college athletics.

Pass.

And SMU is the opposite of that? You could say that same thing about SMU besides being in the middle of nowhere.

 

[Moose Stuff]

Not in my book. Fort Collins is in the middle of nowhere and saying CSU delivers the Denver market is just inaccurate.

They also aren't THAT big of a school comparatively, don't spend enough on athletics, poor following (bad, bad ratings), and have this essential problem of not being good at college athletics.

Pass.

I harshly judge any D1 institution that doesn’t have a baseball team.

 

[Gary's Shirtless Revenge]

And SMU is the opposite of that? You could say that same thing about SMU besides being in the middle of nowhere.

Tiny school yes, but competitively spend money in Athletics and football especially and have the benefit of dfw as a base. Their problem is they are tiny and they suck.

 

[Gary's Shirtless Revenge]

You seem well informed enough and I am grateful for your insider information/industry expertise on the whole being relegated to kids table thing. That list though is just awful. It’s the college football version of island of misfit toys. Outside of BYU there is no program that provides any credibility. Sure Boise was media sweetheart in the BCS Buster days but that has faded and they are still a glorified junior college of an academic institution. How the mighty have fallen for those 8 unlucky enough to be left behind. I’d hate to be responsible for selling ticket packages to watch that sad sack list of potential candidates.

Take solace that Boise, as a football only member, is no worse a contributor in the new Big 12 than KSU and most years would be far better. They punch above their weight and have maintained a solid following post BCS years. Everything else you said is true, why they would be borderline at best.

 

[KillerFrog InD KitchenSink]

You seem well informed enough and I am grateful for your insider information/industry expertise on the whole being relegated to kids table thing. That list though is just awful. It’s the college football version of island of misfit toys. Outside of BYU there is no program that provides any credibility. Sure Boise was media sweetheart in the BCS Buster days but that has faded and they are still a glorified junior college of an academic institution. How the mighty have fallen for those 8 unlucky enough to be left behind. I’d hate to be responsible for selling ticket packages to watch that sad sack list of potential candidates.

I think they are uninspiring, too, but the league isn't in the position to name big name schools. That's the list of expansion candidates.

 

[Mean Purple]

Watching the news reports of the PAC, BIG and ACC meeting to talk about a scheduling alliance worries me. We need to get in the PAC or another Power conference, but not sure we have the right AD at the right time. Watching old guard types actually excited about the idea of going back to a mid major annoying as hell. This conference is dead man walking.

 

[Gary's Shirtless Revenge]

Watching the news reports of the PAC, BIG and ACC meeting to talk about a scheduling alliance worries me. We need to get in the PAC or another Power conference, but not sure we have the right AD at the right time. Watching old guard types actually excited about the idea of going back to a mid major annoying as hell. This conference is dead man walking.

How do you sell somebody something they don't want and don't need?

 

[DeuceBoogieNights]

Tiny school yes, but competitively spend money in Athletics and football especially and have the benefit of dfw as a base. Their problem is they are tiny and they suck.

You know more than me about all this but from the brief research I've done, Colorado State's athletic budget is around 54.3 million and SMU at 64 million. Not a huge difference but I know 10 million isn't chump change. I'm not huge on either, but SMU does nothing to move the needle for me. Anyways, my opinion doesn't matter.

 

[Gary's Shirtless Revenge]

You know more than me about all this but from the brief research I've done, Colorado State's athletic budget is around 54.3 million and SMU at 64 million. Not a huge difference but I know 10 million isn't chump change. I'm not huge on either, but SMU does nothing to move the needle for me. Anyways, my opinion doesn't matter.

The CSU data out there is flawed, by their own admission, as they categorize certain donations to capital campaigns as revenue to the athletics program which inflates their numbers. This isn't common in the EADA data, it's the exception. Adjusting for that and scholarship inflation at SMU, SMU spends good money on athletics compared to their revenue and has been for awhile.

Don't take this as an argument for SMU, I would NOT look to add them to the Big 12, they are towards the bottom of my list and if you neutralize their location because TCU is already in DFW, they are second to last or so.

 

[Jared7]

No, they do not... The AAC failed to get members to agree to a GOR with their new deal.

If I remember correctly, members have to give 27 months notice and there is maybe a small exit fee, think $1-2 million or some such, but that last part could be wrong.

That said, no AAC members are joining the Big 12 until they know the remaining 8 are locked together past 2025.

The AAC by-laws specify the 27-month notice you mention and a $10 million exit fee. UConn's recent departure was settled for $17 million - they only gave 12-month's notice and the figure was negotiated (the AAC started from about $40 million and came down). It was/will be paid as an $11 million reduction in conference revenue deductions and a roughly $1 million per year payment that will last for 6 years or so.

In my view, the Big 12 should/will not even consider expansion until the UT departure is negotiated. The Big 12, as of now, is entitled to 4 years of conference revenue withholdings (roughly $160 million). After that situation is more clear, I think we should consider expansion, but I'm not convinced as yet that we should do it.

 

[Stopit]

The CSU data out there is flawed, by their own admission, as they categorize certain donations to capital campaigns as revenue to the athletics program which inflates their numbers. This isn't common in the EADA data, it's the exception. Adjusting for that and scholarship inflation at SMU, SMU spends good money on athletics compared to their revenue and has been for awhile.

Don't take this as an argument for SMU, I would NOT look to add them to the Big 12, they are towards the bottom of my list and if you neutralize their location because TCU is already in DFW, they are second to last or so.

I have heard the service academies have good TV viewership. Is this true and would that not make them more attractive to a future Big12. What is the value perception of the service academies in the future (by ESPN or FOX) as compared to someone like SMU? Thanks for your insight.

 

[Eight]

I have heard the service academies have good TV viewership. Is this true and would that not make them more attractive to a future Big12. What is the value perception of the service academies in the future (by ESPN or FOX) as compared to someone like SMU? Thanks for your insight.

no, no, no, and no

 

[Stopit]

no, no, no, and no

I am not asking if someone like yourself likes the idea. I am actually asking what the perceived value is from a television revenue view point, compared to someone like SMU. Sorry if I wasn’t clear. I guess the question is really targeted to GSR or someone with similar knowledge.

 

[Eight]

I am not asking if someone like yourself likes the idea. I am actually asking what the perceived value is from a television revenue view point, compared to someone like SMU. Sorry if I wasn’t clear. I guess the question is really targeted to GSR or someone with similar knowledge.

the issue is this is the same version of the same question that keeps getting asked again and again and again because someone read something posted by someone somewhere on the internet with no references given for their data or a talking head who is just turning out chum to get listeners

on page 108 gary listed his 8 theoretical candidates for expansion if gsr was to make the selection and not only is smu in the bottom half and not sure why they would be used as a measuring stick as well as note that gsr doesn't mention any of the academies, even in a football only capcaticy