• The KillerFrogs

#BAYLORTEARS

westoverhillbilly

Active Member
I will defer to your knowledge of Waco, because I have not lived there. I did live in Killeen for 9 months while stationed at Fort Hood, but that's not even close to the same thing.

I was only referring to "...the Baylor fans I know." Admittedly, many of them are ministers and dedicated members of my Southern Baptist church, so they are appalled by the scandal.

Go Frogs!

Frog DJ, if this is indeed the case as I'm sure it is if you've experienced it, why have these Southern Baptist ministers and members been so quiet and not publicly demanded change? Baylor is run by and for Baptists and the university is the beacon of the Baptist faith.. It's not like the press would ignore these Baptist ministers if they reached out.. It's like they're afraid to speak out.. Just a very bad look..
 

Frog DJ

Active Member
Frog DJ, if this is indeed the case as I'm sure it is if you've experienced it, why have these Southern Baptist ministers and members been so quiet and not publicly demanded change? Baylor is run by and for Baptists and the university is the beacon of the Baptist faith.. It's not like the press would ignore these Baptist ministers if they reached out.. It's like they're afraid to speak out.. Just a very bad look..
Some of them have. That same group that former Gov. Mark White belonged to - Bears For Leadership Reform.

Go Frogs!
 
Last edited:

FrogAbroad

Full Member
Frog DJ, if this is indeed the case as I'm sure it is if you've experienced it, why have these Southern Baptist ministers and members been so quiet and not publicly demanded change? Baylor is run by and for Baptists and the university is the beacon of the Baptist faith.. It's not like the press would ignore these Baptist ministers if they reached out.. It's like they're afraid to speak out.. Just a very bad look..
You observations are certainly logical, but based on popularly-believed assumptions that are incorrect.
  1. Baylor has never been under the direction or leadership of the Southern Baptist Convention ("SBC"). Baylor was chartered in 1845 by Baptists in the State of Texas. The SBC was organized in the same year in Virginia but has never had an organizational relationship to Baylor.
  2. Baylor was, indeed, founded by and for Baptists and its historical trajectory evidences that origin through most of the 20th century. The Bapitst organization with direct participation in the election of Baylor's Board of Regents ("BOR") was the Baptist General Convention of Texas ("BGCT") which is a confederation of Baptist churches located in Texas, logically enough. [BGCT had a fraternal relationship with SBC but never anyything more, much less a hierarchical relationship.]
  3. In 1990 the BOR unilaterally voted to remove itself (along with the Baylor Medical system) from its 145-year relationship with BGCT. The BOR became self-perpetuating, nominating/electing 75% of its membership. BGCT was allowed to elect 25% of the BOR's membership.
  4. From 1845 the Baylor charter called for 100% of its BOR members to be Baptist. In 2011 the BOR changed this requirement, allowing up to 25% of its membership to be non-Baptist.
  5. Although Baylor was founded by and ostensibly for Baptists, Baylor's Baptist numbers have been consistently dropping for at least a quarter century. In 2011 31% of the freshman class claimed the label "Baptist," be that SBC Baptist or any one of the other 50+ Baptist "denominations" in the USA. The trend is downward, dropping by about 2% per year. Baylor's 2021 freshman class is projected to be no higher than 20% Baptist.
As I acknowledged, your observations and comments certainly make sense, as long as any Baptist group other than Baylor's BOR has significant influence on how Baylor is run. The reality is, they don't. As a 501(c)(3) organization Baylor has no owner; there is no Baptist church or group of Baptist churches that run Baylor, or to whom the BOR is accountable. The BOR is accountable only to itself, at least as far as earthly law is concerned.

Several on this and other forums have wondered "why the Baptist church doesn't do something" about the Baylor scandals. Beyond the local Baptist congregation, which is self-governed and autonomous, there is no "Baptist church." There are, as I mention in point 5 above, over 50 national-scale confederations of independent, autonomous, self-governing Baptist churches in the US (plus regional, state, local and other Baptist groups around the country) but none of them has governance over Baylor. The BOR is as high as that food chain goes, and not all of those individuals are Baptists.
 
Last edited:

RollToad

Baylor is Trash.
You observations are certainly logical, but based on popularly-believed assumptions that are incorrect.
  1. Baylor has never been under the direction or leadership of the Southern Baptist Convention ("SBC"). Baylor was chartered in 1845 by Baptists in the State of Texas. The SBC was organized in the same year in Virginia but has never had an organizational relationship to Baylor.
  2. Baylor was, indeed, founded by and for Baptists and its historical trajectory evidences that origin through most of the 20th century. The Bapitst organization with direct participation in the election of Baylor's Board of Regents ("BOR") was the Baptist General Convention of Texas ("BGCT") which is a confederation of Baptist churches located in Texas, logically enough. [BGCT had a fraternal relationship with SBC but never anyything more, much less a hierarchical relationship.]
  3. In 1990 the BOR unilaterally voted to remove itself (along with the Baylor Medical system) from its 145-relationship with BGCT. The BOR became self-perpetuating, nominating/electing 75% of its membership. BGCT was allowed to elect 25% of the BOR's membership.
  4. From 1845 the Baylor charter called for 100% of its BOR members to be Baptist. In 2011 the BOR changed this requirement, allowing up to 25% of its membership to be non-Baptist.
  5. Although Baylor was founded by and ostensibly for Baptists, Baylor's Baptist numbers have been consistently dropping for at least a quarter century. In 2011 31% of the freshman class claimed the label "Baptist," be that SBC Baptist or any one of the other 50+ Baptist "denominations" in the USA. The trend is downward, dropping by about 2% per year. Baylor's 2021 freshman class is projected to be no higher than 20% Baptist.
As I acknowledged, your observations and comments certainly make sense, as long as any Baptist group other than Baylor's BOR has significant influence on how Baylor is run. The reality is, they don't. As a 501(c)(3) organization Baylor has no owner; there is no Baptist church or group of Baptist churches that run Baylor, or to whom the BOR is accountable. The BOR is accountable only to itself, at least as far as earthly law is concerned.

Several on this and other forums have wondered "why the Baptist church doesn't do something" about the Baylor scandals. Beyond the local Baptist congregation, which is self-governed and autonomous, there is no "Baptist church." There are, as I mention in point 5 above, over 50 national-scale confederations of independent, autonomous, self-governing Baptist churches in the US (plus regional, state, local and other Baptist groups around the country) but none of them has governance over Baylor. The BOR is as high as that food chain goes, and not all of those individuals are Baptists.
We have a rape fan!
 

froginaustin

Active Member
Or maybe just a Baptist apologist?
I don’t see an apology. Just an explanation. A self-perpetuating board that is solely responsible for what Baylor University is. Not a “Baptist” problem. A “Baylor” problem.

I might say there but for the Grace of God goes us, but I can think of no other universities that have taken Baylor’s path and particular corruption.
 

Tom Brown

Active Member
vader_didnt_read.gif

You observations are certainly logical, but based on popularly-believed assumptions that are incorrect.
  1. Baylor has never been under the direction or leadership of the Southern Baptist Convention ("SBC"). Baylor was chartered in 1845 by Baptists in the State of Texas. The SBC was organized in the same year in Virginia but has never had an organizational relationship to Baylor.
  2. Baylor was, indeed, founded by and for Baptists and its historical trajectory evidences that origin through most of the 20th century. The Bapitst organization with direct participation in the election of Baylor's Board of Regents ("BOR") was the Baptist General Convention of Texas ("BGCT") which is a confederation of Baptist churches located in Texas, logically enough. [BGCT had a fraternal relationship with SBC but never anyything more, much less a hierarchical relationship.]
  3. In 1990 the BOR unilaterally voted to remove itself (along with the Baylor Medical system) from its 145-year relationship with BGCT. The BOR became self-perpetuating, nominating/electing 75% of its membership. BGCT was allowed to elect 25% of the BOR's membership.
  4. From 1845 the Baylor charter called for 100% of its BOR members to be Baptist. In 2011 the BOR changed this requirement, allowing up to 25% of its membership to be non-Baptist.
  5. Although Baylor was founded by and ostensibly for Baptists, Baylor's Baptist numbers have been consistently dropping for at least a quarter century. In 2011 31% of the freshman class claimed the label "Baptist," be that SBC Baptist or any one of the other 50+ Baptist "denominations" in the USA. The trend is downward, dropping by about 2% per year. Baylor's 2021 freshman class is projected to be no higher than 20% Baptist.
As I acknowledged, your observations and comments certainly make sense, as long as any Baptist group other than Baylor's BOR has significant influence on how Baylor is run. The reality is, they don't. As a 501(c)(3) organization Baylor has no owner; there is no Baptist church or group of Baptist churches that run Baylor, or to whom the BOR is accountable. The BOR is accountable only to itself, at least as far as earthly law is concerned.

Several on this and other forums have wondered "why the Baptist church doesn't do something" about the Baylor scandals. Beyond the local Baptist congregation, which is self-governed and autonomous, there is no "Baptist church." There are, as I mention in point 5 above, over 50 national-scale confederations of independent, autonomous, self-governing Baptist churches in the US (plus regional, state, local and other Baptist groups around the country) but none of them has governance over Baylor. The BOR is as high as that food chain goes, and not all of those individuals are Baptists.
 

FrogCop19

Active Member
Isn't that the same thing? I guess not.

To me sounded more like he/she was trying to distance themselves from baylor as a baptist.

It's like someone that has been caught watching the Kardashians or tentacle porn or something and claiming, "No, no, I was just flipping through the channels!"
 

FrogAbroad

Full Member
To me sounded more like he/she was trying to distance themselves from baylor as a baptist.

It's like someone that has been caught watching the Kardashians or tentacle porn or something and claiming, "No, no, I was just flipping through the channels!"
Baylor has already distanced itself from Baptists, except for that stupid slogan "the world's largest Baptist university."
 

Mean Purple

Active Member
I will defer to your knowledge of Waco, because I have not lived there. I did live in Killeen for 9 months while stationed at Fort Hood, but that's not even close to the same thing.

I was only referring to "...the Baylor fans I know." Admittedly, many of them are ministers and dedicated members of my Southern Baptist church, so they are appalled by the scandal.

Go Frogs!
Make sense. Those in the ministry that I know have the same view as what you see. AND, to be fair, and as I have mentioned before...there are those Regent members who moved to kick briles to the curb. They are alumni of bu. One of them is a pastor (one of the 4 who was on 60 minutes)
 

westoverhillbilly

Active Member
I guess I'm glad that FrogAbroad straightened me out on the legal and technical separation of Baylor and the Baptists in that it was factual and took some time to articulate and makes sense in that the Baptist faith is huge throughout the southern U.S. and still pretty dominant throughout the U.S.

Still, powerless as the Baptist clergy may claim to be on Baylor affairs, they've remained eerily silent throughout the process, but they've had some other sexual challenges at their seminary.. Please don't give us some obfuscatory b.s. about how the seminary is an independent entity and isn't accountable to any of the various denominations..

My point is that nobody from the faith seems to be taking ownership in the matter at Baylor for the crimes and inhumanity towards the poor ladies.. Oops, they were staying out late and drinking, so I guess they weren't ladies..
 

Land Frog

Darn baylor!
To me sounded more like he/she was trying to distance themselves from baylor as a baptist.

It's like someone that has been caught watching the Kardashians or tentacle porn or something and claiming, "No, no, I was just flipping through the channels!"
So you watch the Karashians. And what the darn is tentacle porn?
 
Top