AroundWorldFrog
Full Member
Interesting stats. Make of it what you will.
2017 Hill vs 2014, 2015 Boykin and the Wild Frog Meltdown
- Thread starter AroundWorldFrog
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FBallFan123
Active Member
Interseting stats, although Boykin threw it and ran it more in the old offense.
Boykin averaged 36 attempts per game, 325 yards per game.
HIll is just at bout 30 attempts per game, and about 250 yards per game.
Boykin was also rushing for about 55 yards per game, where as Hill is around 16.
Different offenses, quarterbacks were asked to do different things.
Boykin averaged 36 attempts per game, 325 yards per game.
HIll is just at bout 30 attempts per game, and about 250 yards per game.
Boykin was also rushing for about 55 yards per game, where as Hill is around 16.
Different offenses, quarterbacks were asked to do different things.
AroundWorldFrog
Full Member
Agree, although you could argue, with all the drops and no Doctson, that Hill really has thrown well this year.
jake102
Active Member
At this point, I don't really think it's an argument. He has played very well this season and is playing better as the season progresses.
It is also a HUGE help that we are settling into a defined group of WRs... Diarse and Reagor on the outside with Turpin and White on the inside. Occasionally Austin plays on the outside and Nixon on the inside.
Uncle_Frog
Active Member
I would take 2017 KH over 2014 Boykin, but 2015 Boykin was simply unstoppable until he got hurt and had 50+ ypg rushing with 9 rushing TDs in only 9.5 games. Kenny isn't running much this year and I think that is part of the plan to limit the hits on him.
Kenny has been extremely efficient and only has 3 total turnovers compared to 17 total touchdowns this year. That is amazing and if he keeps that up we can win every game we play.
I would have loved to see what Boykin 2015 would have done with the 2017 defense...
Kenny has been extremely efficient and only has 3 total turnovers compared to 17 total touchdowns this year. That is amazing and if he keeps that up we can win every game we play.
I would have loved to see what Boykin 2015 would have done with the 2017 defense...
FBallFan123
Active Member
Hill has been very good this year.
I just think it's fair to say Boykin was asked to do more in the 2015 offense.
I mean, Boykin was the 2nd leading rusher on that team. (Hill is currently 4th leading rusher this year....he was 2nd last year.)
Hill is a very good runner in his own right....but the TCU offense has scaled back his rushing attempts.
Hill hasn't been asked to run as much this year as he was last year, in part because of a senior-laden offensive line and a deep group of running backs.
Plus, TCU's defense looks very good this year....fair to say it looks better than the 2015 version.
Limp Lizard
Full Member
I think Hill runs the speed option better than Boykin. Boykin tended to keep the ball when he should have pitched. Boykin had a stronger arm and could throw the deep ball better. Hill throws better medium-distance over the middle, which was something Boykin could never get the hang of.
Boykin was really good in the red zone, zipping a pass into tight coverage.
Hard to really evaluate Boykin because he had Doctson. Just throw the ball in the general direction where Josh was and it was caught.
Boykin was really good in the red zone, zipping a pass into tight coverage.
Hard to really evaluate Boykin because he had Doctson. Just throw the ball in the general direction where Josh was and it was caught.
WhatTheFrog
Active Member
I think the numbers would be even better this season for Hill if he would just step into a few more passes and take the hit rather than throwing off of his back foot. He's made some really great throws this season when stepping into his passes. He's had some real ducks this season when throwing off his back foot. I figure we've missed out on at least 3 TDs because of the back footed throws.
BrewingFrog
Was I supposed to type something here?
I think the important comparison is 2016 Hill v. 2017 Hill. He has improved lightyears past my expectations (which were literally subterranean) and the Staff has done a far better job of putting him in situations that allow him to showcase his strengths. While he still has work to do to improve, it is in a few particular areas and not simply across the board.
SnoSki
Full Member
Probably already been posted but I’d like to see their 2015 TD/INT ratios with rush tds added.
W
Way of the Frog
Guest
Yet another example of why you can not purely use numbers when comparing performances.
Ghost of Generic makes the comment that Boykin benefited from having a first round draft pick to throw to compared to Reagor and the others Hill is working with this year.
One small problem, he doesn't take into consideration the challenges Boykin faced that year due to injuries among the receivers.
Doctson started 2015 nicked up and finished the year missing the last 3 games, Listenbee as we found out later got hurt in the first game of the year and only played in 11 of 13, Gray missed the entire season, Slanina only played in 4 of 13 games, and Porter missed 5 games with a knee/ankle.
That is 4 top returning receivers for 2015 either gone or hurt and it took help from other positions (Nixon was a running back in 2015 and was #2 in catches) and true freshmen (Turpin was #3 in catches, Stewart, and Austin.
Not knocking Kenny, but you can say looking back at 2015 and how things have played out in 2017 that the receiving group in 2017 is definitely deeper and as a collective more talented than that banged up group in 2015.
There is no one player as talented at Doctson nor could pull off the game Josh had in Lubbock, but right now no one players has to do that for this offense to work. This is a much more balanced offense and receiver group.
Unfortunately none of that is factored in when you look purely at numbers and presume there were generated in a similar environment when it fact they were created in some type of competitive vacuum.
Ghost of Generic makes the comment that Boykin benefited from having a first round draft pick to throw to compared to Reagor and the others Hill is working with this year.
One small problem, he doesn't take into consideration the challenges Boykin faced that year due to injuries among the receivers.
Doctson started 2015 nicked up and finished the year missing the last 3 games, Listenbee as we found out later got hurt in the first game of the year and only played in 11 of 13, Gray missed the entire season, Slanina only played in 4 of 13 games, and Porter missed 5 games with a knee/ankle.
That is 4 top returning receivers for 2015 either gone or hurt and it took help from other positions (Nixon was a running back in 2015 and was #2 in catches) and true freshmen (Turpin was #3 in catches, Stewart, and Austin.
Not knocking Kenny, but you can say looking back at 2015 and how things have played out in 2017 that the receiving group in 2017 is definitely deeper and as a collective more talented than that banged up group in 2015.
There is no one player as talented at Doctson nor could pull off the game Josh had in Lubbock, but right now no one players has to do that for this offense to work. This is a much more balanced offense and receiver group.
Unfortunately none of that is factored in when you look purely at numbers and presume there were generated in a similar environment when it fact they were created in some type of competitive vacuum.
DeuceBoogieNights
Active Member
Not arguing against Hill's success this season, hes been solid but I would be curious to know how Doctson's career would have gone had Hill been his QB. Hill doesnt have the deep ball ability that Boykin had.
CountryFrog
Active Member
If Hill keeps playing the way he has the last few weeks then it will probably be the best year a QB has had at TCU in about 80 years.
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