• The KillerFrogs

The Harris/Biden Administration: Coming Together to Build Back Better

TCUdirtbag

Active Member
LOL. Oh, noes....he did the "full stop" thingy. I guess the debate is over!

This is not true. There are many house democrats and a few senate democrats who will not support tougher gun control laws because they answer to their constituents that don't want them.

Sorry. Not letting your either fully uninformed or entirely dishonest claim off the hook on this one.

You said “many” house democrats and “a few” democratic senators. You could only provide one name - joe manchin. And yet even that was incorrect.

If you look back at my post, I clearly said: only one political party is holding up baseline bipartisan-supported reform. Joe Manchin is the most conservative Democratic Senator, but he is not holding up the sort of reforms I describe. See, for example, the Manchin-Toomey bill in all its failed iterations.
 
Read the whole thing. You throw some barbs at me and democrats (some of which are deserved) and “social justice” but I could tell you read the link. I think most of your points are misguided and an attempt to reconcile what you want to be true with the reality that doing nothing and/or if anything making guns easier to procure has not slowed mass school shootings. We may not agree today but I consider your even reading and considering and maybe finding a minor point or two to almost agree on to be progress.

Since everyone here feels they are entitled to my time to point by point explain everything they demand and respond to everything they post, I hope this response is moderately sufficient. Of course it won’t be so fire away.
Your irony meter just exploded.

As for the barbs at you, you completely lack self-awareness. You come in hot, as usual, and then play the victim over what was a really benign comment.
 
Sorry. Not letting your either fully uninformed or entirely dishonest claim off the hook on this one.

You said “many” house democrats and “a few” democratic senators. You could only provide one name - joe manchin. And yet even that was incorrect.

If you look back at my post, I clearly said: only one political party is holding up baseline bipartisan-supported reform. Joe Manchin is the most conservative Democratic Senator, but he is not holding up the sort of reforms I describe. See, for example, the Manchin-Toomey bill in all its failed iterations.
Sorry, but I'm not here to google for you. The proof is that the Democrats have had control of both the House and Senate numerous times since school shootings started and have failed to do what you think needs to be done every single time.
 

LVH

Active Member
Almost all of the perpetrators of mass shootings going back years (including this POS) were on the FBI's or law enforcement's radar. Yet not one of them was stopped when they could or should have been. Why?

But the FBI has time to investigate "domestic terrorist" parents and stage fake kidnappings to entrap "white supremacists" and chase down Hillary's Russian collusion allegations. So done with this [ #2020 ].
I guess as usual I will be the one to say what everyone else is thinking but is too afraid to say - the FBI/CIA grooms a lot of these shooters.

Not sure if they groomed yesterday's shooter, but we have actual evidence of the FBI targeting people and setting them up to commit violence. Hell they tried to groom people in Michigan to kidnap Gretchen Whitmer.
 

FrogUltimate

Active Member
I guess as usual I will be the one to say what everyone else is thinking
The thought literally hadn't crossed my mind or anyone else besides yours. Sorry man - but you need to step away. The FBI/CIA isn't grooming a troubled teenager without that kid telling the world about it. This isn't one giant conspiracy with every detail orchestrated. The government isn't remotely that competent
 

AroundWorldFrog

Full Member
The thought literally hadn't crossed my mind or anyone else besides yours. Sorry man - but you need to step away. The FBI/CIA isn't grooming a troubled teenager without that kid telling the world about it. This isn't one giant conspiracy with every detail orchestrated. The government isn't remotely that competent
Absolutely incompetent. Again, so many of these shooters have been on the radar of the FBI and law enforcement.
 
Here are some gun laws in other countries:


I kinda like this approach on gun licenses from Switzerland. Don't know what "suspicion that he would endanger himself or others with the weapon" means in practical terms, but I like that it is reviewed/renewed fairly often (6-9 months). Maybe it could help get the high risk gun owners earlier on the radar?:

Private gun ownership generally requires a license, for which an applicant "must be at least 18 years of age, may not have been placed under guardianship, may not give cause for suspicion that he would endanger himself or others with the weapon, and may not have a criminal record with a conviction for a violent crime or of several convictions for nonviolent crimes," according to the Library of Congress's review of Swiss gun laws. The license is valid for six to nine months, and it's usually valid only for one weapon.

I guess I think a few more hoops for gun owners while maintaining the right to bear arms seems like a reasonable way to go. I get that more restrictive gun laws may not prevent every tragedy (important to remember that most gun tragedies are not mass shootings), but I think it is reasonable to strive for a middle ground that can result in better gun fatality stats, while maintaining the ability to own guns.
 

LVH

Active Member
Here are some gun laws in other countries:


I kinda like this approach on gun licenses from Switzerland. Don't know what "suspicion that he would endanger himself or others with the weapon" means in practical terms, but I like that it is reviewed/renewed fairly often (6-9 months). Maybe it could help get the high risk gun owners earlier on the radar?:



I guess I think a few more hoops for gun owners while maintaining the right to bear arms seems like a reasonable way to go. I get that more restrictive gun laws may not prevent every tragedy (important to remember that most gun tragedies are not mass shootings), but I think it is reasonable to strive for a middle ground that can result in better gun fatality stats, while maintaining the ability to own guns.
Licenses lead to a registry. Registries lead to confiscation. No thanks. It's not the government's business how many guns I own.
 

LVH

Active Member
The thought literally hadn't crossed my mind or anyone else besides yours. Sorry man - but you need to step away. The FBI/CIA isn't grooming a troubled teenager without that kid telling the world about it. This isn't one giant conspiracy with every detail orchestrated. The government isn't remotely that competent
The FBI tried to get a mentally ill 23 year old to blow up a building Timothy McVeigh style.

 

LVH

Active Member
Sure there are those on the left who want that, but most on the left (and many the right) really do want to find a middle ground on gun laws where guns can still be fairly easily owned and enjoyed but gun violence is reduced with a more checks and balances than we currently have.
Name ONE gun control you leftists fantasize about that would stop any of this.

Name ONE.

Gun control is desired by the left because a disarmed populace is an obedient populace. You already believe people should be vaccinated against their will, no surprise you also want us disarmed on our knees at the mercy of our government.
 

LVH

Active Member
Well, not being allowed to buy a gun at 18 would have....
If you can sign up for the military at 18 and get your face blown off in one of the military industrial complex's stupid wars, you should be able to buy a gun at 18. Constitutional rights should not have an age limit anyway.
 

Whiskey Frog

Active Member
Yes, the left loves platitudes about gun control. They tug at people's heartstrings and score some political points.

Then they do nothing. If they actually solved the problem, there would be one less issue to get people to vote for them.
Bingo, but thats the case for both sides. Why republicans never decrease the deficit and democrats never do anything meaningful? people gotta stay mad to vote.
 
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