TCU Golf 2024-2025

[JogginFrog]

Reminds me of the 4 handicap guy on Twitter who says he can beat LPGA pros, lol.

I don't care what tees they played from, 64 is special. Colonial still requires excellent approach shots from any distance, and you have to make some putts. And you have to drive it well to put yourself in position to hit those iron shots. She averaged 67 over the three days. That's some elite golf.

They played it at 6,092, which for a par 70 is maybe 100 yards shorter than I'd expect for collegiate women, but it seems they got it right, given the scoring. Field average was 72.7.

Looking at the yardages, I might have liked to see them play 11 at 535 instead of 495 and 13 at 145 instead of 126 (since 16 was also 126 and wasn't stretchable)--those played as the easiest holes--but those are my only quibbles.

College women so rarely get to play Tour venues in competition; great to see them lining up for a chance to play Colonial.

 

[Wexahu]

Reminds me of the 4 handicap guy on Twitter who says he can beat LPGA pros, lol.

I don't care what tees they played from, 64 is special. Colonial still requires excellent approach shots from any distance, and you have to make some putts. And you have to drive it well to put yourself in position to hit those iron shots. She averaged 67 over the three days. That's some elite golf.

Yeah, a 4 handicap man would completely get obliterated by LPGA pros. No contest.

But there are some who kind of go to the other extreme with this comparison. A legitimate +2 guy can absolutely hang with LPGA pros, if not beat them comfortably on longer courses. Maybe not a top 10 in the world type player, but the average to decent LPGA pro. I've personally witnessed it with a former Women's US Open champ. And there are some that would absolutely dispute that.

Honestly, it's kind of silly some of the listed yardages at LPGA tour events vs where they actually play from on tournament day.

 

[gohornedfrogs]

Yeah, a 4 handicap man would completely get obliterated by LPGA pros. No contest.

But there are some who kind of go to the other extreme with this comparison. A legitimate +2 guy can absolutely hang with LPGA pros, if not beat them comfortably on longer courses. Maybe not a top 10 in the world type player, but the average to decent LPGA pro. I've personally witnessed it with a former Women's US Open champ. And there are some that would absolutely dispute that.

Honestly, it's kind of silly some of the listed yardages at LPGA tour events vs where they actually play from on tournament day.

Yes, a tournament-tested +2 whose handicap was calculated with a lot of high-level tournament play can certainly compete with a run-of-the-mill LPGA player on courses 6,500 and beyond. At 7,500, it might not even be a fight if the +2 is an under 30 guy with 120 mph club speed. The club guy who is a +2 but hasn't played in anything but club events the last five years would struggle.

As for yardages, the PGA Tour and PGA Tour Champions inflate their yardages, too. It's not necessarily an effort to be deceptive, though. Weather conditions and giving the players a variety of holes / pin locations play a big factor on a day-to-day basis.

 

[Wexahu]

Yes, a tournament-tested +2 whose handicap was calculated with a lot of high-level tournament play can certainly compete with a run-of-the-mill LPGA player on courses 6,500 and beyond. At 7,500, it might not even be a fight if the +2 is an under 30 guy with 120 mph club speed. The club guy who is a +2 but hasn't played in anything but club events the last five years would struggle.

As for yardages, the PGA Tour and PGA Tour Champions inflate their yardages, too. It's not necessarily an effort to be deceptive, though. Weather conditions and giving the players a variety of holes / pin locations play a big factor on a day-to-day basis.

Agree with all of this. There are some good players out there that fall apart under tournament conditions, and they'd especially do that with galleries, TV, etc. But they'd eventually get used to that too I would guess. An LPGA player on a 6,200 yard, par 72 course can shoot some low numbers. But so can a relatively tournament tested weekend +2 men's player, most just hardly ever play courses of that length.

I think the LPGA and Champions tour inflates yardages worse, especially the LPGA. They'll show Lydio Ko hitting a 9-iron from 130 into a hole listed at 410 yards after a drive that went 245. hmmmm.

 

[gohornedfrogs]

Agree with all of this. There are some good players out there that fall apart under tournament conditions, and they'd especially do that with galleries, TV, etc. But they'd eventually get used to that too I would guess. An LPGA player on a 6,200 yard, par 72 course can shoot some low numbers. But so can a relatively tournament tested weekend +2 men's player, most just hardly ever play courses of that length.

I think the LPGA and Champions tour inflates yardages worse, especially the LPGA. They'll show Lydio Ko hitting a 9-iron from 130 into a hole listed at 410 yards after a drive that went 245. hmmmm.

The amateur +2 would be exposed in the short game. Twenty years ago, LPGA players were far behind the PGA Tour players around the greens, despite the conventional wisdom. That's not true any more. LPGA players have made their biggest improvements around the greens over the last couple of decades relative to the men.

There are several +2 guys at Colonial. I doubt many of them ever shoot 64 from the white tees during a hit-and-giggle event on a Sunday, much less one where they have to post their score for everyone to see. If you're a +2 already, and then you shoot a 64 even from 6,200 yards, you'd immediately become a +4 to +4.5. So by definition, that kind of score is an outlier for a +2.

 

[Wexahu]

The amateur +2 would be exposed in the short game. Twenty years ago, LPGA players were far behind the PGA Tour players around the greens, despite the conventional wisdom. That's not true any more. LPGA players have made their biggest improvements around the greens over the last couple of decades relative to the men.

There are several +2 guys at Colonial. I doubt many of them ever shoot 64 from the white tees during a hit-and-giggle event on a Sunday, much less one where they have to post their score for everyone to see. If you're a +2 already, and then you shoot a 64 even from 6,200 yards, you'd immediately become a +4 to +4.5. So by definition, that kind of score is an outlier for a +2.

I don't think many LPGA pros would shoot 64 from the white tees at Colonial (actually, you probably meant some sort of red/white tee combo, the white tees are 6,550 yards. Maybe a couple would, but maybe we're talking about two different things. I don't think a +2 handicap is as good as Nelly Korda or any of the other of the very top players. But I think if you'd drop a +2 into an LPGA tournament they would be competitive with a vast majority of the field.

Last year's US Women's Open, played on a par 70 course that was probably about 6,300 yards. Middle of the pack finished about +11 for the week. +8 made the cut. I just gotta think if you made it a field of reasonably tournament tested +2 amateur middle-aged men, the scores wouldn't be any worse. And I know US Open setup and all that.

I would venture to guess that the legitimate +2 guys at Colonial hardly ever play the course at 6,200-6,300 yards.

 

[gohornedfrogs]

I don't think many LPGA pros would shoot 64 from the white tees at Colonial (actually, you probably meant some sort of red/white tee combo, the white tees are 6,550 yards. Maybe a couple would, but maybe we're talking about two different things. I don't think a +2 handicap is as good as Nelly Korda or any of the other of the very top players. But I think if you'd drop a +2 into an LPGA tournament they would be competitive with a vast majority of the field.

Last year's US Women's Open, played on a par 70 course that was probably about 6,300 yards. Middle of the pack finished about +11 for the week. +8 made the cut. I just gotta think if you made it a field of reasonably tournament tested +2 amateur middle-aged men, the scores wouldn't be any worse. And I know US Open setup and all that.

I would venture to guess that the legitimate +2 guys at Colonial hardly ever play the course at 6,200-6,300 yards.

Lancaster Country Club played almost as hard as Oakmont did in 2010. I've played Oakmont well over a hundred times. And I've played there with many guys in the +2 range over the years. I have a standing bet they won't break 80 the first time they play it, and I think I've only lost that bet once. I played there with a former all-SWC golfer in the 90s, just a few years removed from college and still finishing in the top 10-15 in the Texas amateur consistently, and he shot 86 the first time he saw the course. Another guy -- very similar player -- shot 88. I walked the course with Morgan Pressel a few weeks before the 2010 Women's Open and watched her shoot 75 the first time she saw it. It was pretty impressive, and she didn't play that well. Only time I ever saw a first-timer tear it up was when I played in the state amateur there in the 90s and was paired with a guy who had just graduated from UNC a few weeks earlier and was preparing to turn pro. He shot 67, and it was a thing of beauty.

The game changes on northeastern courses that have fast, firm bent/poa mix greens at US Open speeds (even Women's Open speeds), with deep fescue/rye rough.

 

[Wexahu]

Lancaster Country Club played almost as hard as Oakmont did in 2010. I've played Oakmont well over a hundred times. And I've played there with many guys in the +2 range over the years. I have a standing bet they won't break 80 the first time they play it, and I think I've only lost that bet once. I played there with a former all-SWC golfer in the 90s, just a few years removed from college and still finishing in the top 10-15 in the Texas amateur consistently, and he shot 86 the first time he saw the course. Another guy -- very similar player -- shot 88. I walked the course with Morgan Pressel a few weeks before the 2010 Women's Open and watched her shoot 75 the first time she saw it. It was pretty impressive, and she didn't play that well. Only time I ever saw a first-timer tear it up was when I played in the state amateur there in the 90s and was paired with a guy who had just graduated from UNC a few weeks earlier and was preparing to turn pro. He shot 67, and it was a thing of beauty.

The game changes on northeastern courses that have fast, firm bent/poa mix greens at US Open speeds (even Women's Open speeds), with deep fescue/rye rough.

I get all that. I doubt a +2 first timer at Oakmont would break 80 from all the way back (and they certainly wouldn't in men's US Open conditions), but I bet they would break 80 playing the course from 6,300 yards. Surely a men's player of that caliber wouldn't tee it up from the white tees the first time they played it, would they? The course rating from 6,300-6,400 yards is about 72.5, the course would have to be ridiculously tricked up for a legitimate +2 handicap to struggle breaking 80 from that yardage.

Ironically, I've played with one of the players who finished 5th in that tournament (and have good friends who have played with her many, many times), so that's one of my points of reference. They are good, but their ability relative to a good men's amateur player, even just a guy who plays in club events, is overstated.

 

[JogginFrog]

TCU men are playing in The Goodwin at Stanford (Thu.-Sat.). It's a good opportunity with a large field (30 teams) to help with overall record, and 8 teams ranked in the 25-50 range--enabling meaningful upward movement.

TCU is in 12th after Day 1. Not bad, but nothing yet to help the Frogs get back into the top 50. Still, TCU is only 8 back of the lead.

TCU does have one player in the top 10--unfortunately, Hudson Wilt (68) is competing as an individual.

 

[JogginFrog]

Unless the TCU men have a special round today, the record will show that their 2025 NCAA tournament chances died yesterday at the 11th and 12th holes at Stanford. Frogs collectively went +10 on the two downhill par 4s, one of which is the fourth-easiest hole on the property. That dropped TCU from 12th to 18th in a bubble-busting field.

Hudson Wilt and Joe Pagdin are just inside the top 25 individually.

Edit: Frogs had their best round of the tournament on Saturday (Even) but they only moved up 1 spot to 17th. Best finish among individuals was T49 (Pagdin, Wylie and H. Wilt). Mountaineer Invitational in two weeks is TCU's last event before the Big 12 Championships.

 

[JogginFrog]

Hayden Springer with a bogey-free 64 on Saturday to jump into the top 20 at the Houston Open. He's part of a big pack at T14. His focus is likely on a top 10 to ensure an additional start.

 

[JogginFrog]

Springer makes up for a terrible start (+4 thru 6) with a great finish (-5 over last 7) to finish T15 and bank $164K. He's now 78th in the FedEx Cup standings.

 

[JogginFrog]

No current Frogs playing in the Augusta National Women's Am this year. Former Frog Caitlyn Macnab made the cut on the number; she'll get another competitive round at Augusta on Saturday.

 

[JogginFrog]

TCU women finish third in Tucson, a shot back of Arizona and 10 back of Kansas State. Story of the tournament was K State's Carla Bernat, who was the highest-ranked individual in the field and who won by 9, comprising the whole margin of victory.

Carla Bernat's run of form continued this week; she just won the Augusta National Women's Amateur with three straight 68s.

 

[ShreveFrog]

Hoge is shooting up the leaderboard in San Antonio. -3 on the day thru 14 and tied for second, 3 strokes behind the leader Harmon who is +2 on the day thru 7.

 

[ShreveFrog]

Hoge added one more birdie and a clutch par save from a greenside bunker on 18. In the clubhouse with sole possession of 2nd. They're fighting a 2-club wind so Harman won't be able to separate much. Sunday will be interesting.

 

[ShreveFrog]

Tom with the low round of the day and only bogey-free round of -4 is in third place at -8 going into Sunday.
Andrew Novak took advantage of a lucky bounce off the wall on the par 3 16th to make par and is in second place at -9. Harman had an even par 3rd round. He has a 3-shot lead, -12. Windy and cold tomorrow. Harmon will be tough to catch. His short game and sand game are so good.

 

[ShreveFrog]

Tom had a tough day, as did everyone in windy, cool conditions. Ended up tied for 5th (-4), 5 strokes behind the champ Harman (-9.) Good payday for Tom though!

 

[JogginFrog]

Tom had a tough day, as did everyone in windy, cool conditions. Ended up tied for 5th (-4), 5 strokes behind the champ Harman (-9.) Good payday for Tom though!

Had good looks to get into the top 3 on the last 2 holes, but even putting is tough in those conditions. Congrats to Tom on a great week. Back in the top 20 on the FedEx Cup list.

 

[JogginFrog]

Camille Min-Gaultier is continuing her fine freshman season by co-leading the Big 12 Championship through two rounds at Houston Oaks, following a 72 with a 68.

As a team, TCU got off to a rocky start yesterday, with the five players combining for only 6 birdies in a round that left the Frogs (projected second) in fifth place +9. Today, Min-Gaultier matched that birdie total all by herself, and the Frogs moved up to third after posting the best round of the day (Even). At +9, they are 2 shots back of Oklahoma State and 3 back of Houston. The highest-ranked team, Arizona State, may not be used to Texas grass or humidity--Sun Devils are +17.

Sofia Barroso Sá is T10. Through 36 holes, she has 33 pars--so consistent.

Final round tomorrow--hope the putts are falling. Frogs have a shot at the conference title! If you're in the neighborhood, go cheer 'em on!