• The KillerFrogs

PGA Championship pick'em game and Charles Schwab Challenge thread

JogginFrog

JogginFrog

Active Member
In Round 3, @hometown frog continued to make the competition uninteresting, although he finally had a player post an over-par round. Meanwhile, the two guys left on @Horned Toad 's roster shot a pair of 64s, but since he didn't change out the guys who missed the cut, he also gets saddled with a pair of 75s (worst score in the field). Still made up ground on me.

Standings:
-20 @hometown frog
-2 @ShreveFrog
+3 @gohornedfrogs
+3 JogginFrog
+8 @Horned Toad
 
Horned Toad

Horned Toad

Active Member
JogginFrog said:
In Round 3, @hometown frog continued to make the competition uninteresting, although he finally had a player post an over-par round. Meanwhile, the two guys left on @Horned Toad 's roster shot a pair of 64s, but since he didn't change out the guys who missed the cut, he also gets saddled with a pair of 75s (worst score in the field). Still made up ground on me.

Standings:
-20 @hometown frog
-2 @ShreveFrog
+3 @gohornedfrogs
+3 JogginFrog
+8 @Horned Toad
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I’m trying to win the wooden spoon award like in Superbru! I’m killing it!
 
P

Putt4Purple

Active Member
JetFlyingFrog said:
just me or is no one there? looks emptier than i've ever seen it.
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It’s sad. There are people there and most are being led or filtered to corporate tents or seating areas out of view from the TV cameras. This is a death wish on Colonial. Money hungry corporate greed. Who wants to watch a golf tournament with no patrons around the green? I saw this last year walking the course and tried to get a nice location as a walking patron and it was impossible! I thought it was only because of the course reconstruction but this year no changes have been made for the walk on patron on the back nine! The front nine is not as bad but still changes for the TV viewing audience to see that there are no patrons!
In 5 years the Colonial National Invitational Golf Tournament as we all knew for decades will no longer survive. Very sad!!
 
JogginFrog

JogginFrog

Active Member
One thing I noticed while watching the highlights was a big pile of dirt opposite the 13th tee, I think. Probably off grounds but not the kind of thing you usually see in a PGA Tour camera shot.
 
W

Wexahu

Full Member
Chongo94 said:
Been thinking the same thing all week.
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It’s an unpopular opinion with some, but the “improvements” made to the course have not enhanced the tournament at all. They took a flat course that lacked a little wow factor and made it flatter while removing most of whatever wow factor it had. Still a fine course, but it’s just a pretty boring watch, especially on TV.

I’d like to know the thinking behind the changes to 9 and 13. 13 used to be a fun hole, now it’s just like any other 200 yard par three surrounded by bunkers. And #4? 250 yards long, no bunkers, no water, just a big green surrounded by grass and over the green is jail because of the green contour. So you have every pro just trying to kinda bounce something up short to leave an easy chip or a 40 foot uphill putt. That hole is like a par 4 on a cheap executive course. Zero design ingenuity whatsoever. I just don’t get it.
 
JogginFrog

JogginFrog

Active Member
@Wexahu, I agree on 13 for sure--the changes are boring and the redesign doesn't fit with the rest of the course. While there was no way to replicate the 1941 look with a low green on the edge of the river, I'd have liked to see a diagonal green with a shaved bank and less sand that plays more like a longer version of Augusta #12. The course isn't just for the pros, but that hole was designed to be tough and the restoration is toothless.

I also agree that the flatter profile looks worse on TV. Yes, 17 needed more pinnable locations, but the intimidation factor is gone--I liked the challenge of having to hit a precise, late-in-the-round short approach. Don't need a reprise of #10.

But I disagree on the bounced-in approaches on 4 and a few other flattish holes. Restoring the firmness of the course and asking the pros to play run-up shots is great. They are hardly ever asked to do that in today's aerial game, and that's exactly what a Texas course should feature. Some of the best highlights have been shots landing short and running up close, sometimes with unexpected bounces.
 
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W

Wexahu

Full Member
JogginFrog said:
@Wexahu, I agree on 13 for sure--the changes are boring and the redesign doesn't fit with the rest of the course. While there was no way to replicate the 1941 look with a low green on the edge of the river, I'd have liked to see a diagonal green with a shaved bank and less sand that plays more like a longer version of Augusta #12. The course isn't just for the pros, but that hole was designed to be tough and the restoration is toothless.

I also agree that the flatter profile looks worse on TV. Yes, 17 needed more pinnable locations, but the intimidation factor is gone--I liked the challenge of having to hit a precise, late-in-the-round short approach. Don't need a reprise of #10.

But I disagree on the bounced-in approaches on 4 and a few other flattish holes. Restoring the firmness of the course and asking the pros to play run-up shots is great. They are hardly ever asked to do that in today's aerial game, and that's exactly what a Texas course should feature. Some of the best highlights have been shots landing short and running up close, sometimes with unexpected bounces.
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Firm greens are great. That’s really all the former course needed IMO.

#4 is not much of a hole. It’s just long. There’s just so much more they could have done, to not only 4, but to many others. Trying to bring it back 80 years just doesn’t make any sense to me, who cares what some blueprint looks like from 1940?
 
JogginFrog

JogginFrog

Active Member
I'm interested in the thoughts of members and guests about the "barranca." Watching Scottie recover from left of 7 yesterday was great, but there's no way to replicate Cali-style hit-or-miss lies in Texas ditches--there's just too much vegetation to manage. When I heard Hanse talk about creating spaces where recovery may or may not be possible, I thought, "I'll believe it when I hear it from the grounds crew."
 
ShreveFrog

ShreveFrog

Full Member
I thought what Nantz and the announcers just said was interesting -- speculating that maybe they should reverse the 9's. That would put The Horrible Horseshoe on network tv. Drawbacks I see is that #9 is not that great of a finishing hole, and #10 isn't a great starting hole.
 
JogginFrog

JogginFrog

Active Member
ShreveFrog said:
I thought what Nantz and the announcers just said was interesting -- speculating that maybe they should reverse the 9's. That would put The Horrible Horseshoe on network tv. Drawbacks I see is that #9 is not that great of a finishing hole, and #10 isn't a great starting hole.
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When you look at the chance for dramatic scoring swings, Nantz & company are correct. Six of the eight holes with the highest scoring variation are on the front nine.
 
T

The Artist Formerly Known as PhormerPhrog

Full Member
Putt4Purple said:
It’s sad. There are people there and most are being led or filtered to corporate tents or seating areas out of view from the TV cameras. This is a death wish on Colonial. Money hungry corporate greed. Who wants to watch a golf tournament with no patrons around the green? I saw this last year walking the course and tried to get a nice location as a walking patron and it was impossible! I thought it was only because of the course reconstruction but this year no changes have been made for the walk on patron on the back nine! The front nine is not as bad but still changes for the TV viewing audience to see that there are no patrons!
In 5 years the Colonial National Invitational Golf Tournament as we all knew for decades will no longer survive. Very sad!!
Click to expand...

It's the PGA. They wanted uniformity at all their tournaments and they've achieved it. Boring, thin crowds. Grounds passes have doubled so the casual fan that doesn't have deep pockets or corporate hookups is rethinking how they spend their time. This was the first time in maybe 15 years that I didn't go and I had no FOMO at all. Colonial's corporate sales guy told me, pre-covid, that the PGA would eventually do this and they did. He said members welcome the change so they don't have to volunteer as much and the exclusivity component gets them further away from the casual fan.
 
gohornedfrogs

gohornedfrogs

Tier 1
The Artist Formerly Known as PhormerPhrog said:
It's the PGA. They wanted uniformity at all their tournaments and they've achieved it. Boring, thin crowds. Grounds passes have doubled so the casual fan that doesn't have deep pockets or corporate hookups is rethinking how they spend their time. This was the first time in maybe 15 years that I didn't go and I had no FOMO at all. Colonial's corporate sales guy told me, pre-covid, that the PGA would eventually do this and they did. He said members welcome the change so they don't have to volunteer as much and the exclusivity component gets them further away from the casual fan.
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This is not just a PGA Tour thing. It's an event "ticketing" thing. The trend among the so-called ticket experts is to move towards the more premium experience. Like a lot of industries, the ticketing industry gets caught up in trendy groupthink and all follow along when someone finds something that works.

I predict this will go on for a few years until they realize that they've tapped out the market for this premium experience, and then they'll move back towards taking care of the casual fan.

For what it's worth, the US Open at Oakmont (not a PGA Tour event -- a USGA event) has done the same thing. They will have far fewer large corporate hospitality tents, but more tents where individual fans can buy premium tickets with admission to tents that have food & beverages. They are also selling fewer "grounds only" tickets to push people to buy these more expensive tickets. A grounds only ticket for Thursday is almost $200. To get into the Champions Pavilion (no free food) is $350+ per day. If you want a ticket into a tent that has free F&B, it's over $1,000 per day. That's lot of extra money for a little better view and some food, but they sold it out. Oh, and if you want a ticket with a guaranteed bleacher seat, it's about $750 per day (and they have far fewer bleacher seats than previous Opens there).
 
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