Houston Chronicle: Texas, Oklahoma reach out to SEC about joining conference

[Jared7]

The 2022 SEC schedule is going to be announced tonight; not including UT and OU. Nothing is ever "final" but, to me, this more or less rules out the possibility that they will be exiting the Big 12 quickly and 2023 now would be the earliest. I think 2024 is probably most likely because that would coincide with the anticipated start of the SEC's new ESPN deal. I also think that the 2023 date negotiated with BYU and Houston for entrance more or less ruled out 2022, but tonight's announcement more or less confirms it as well.

 

[Prime BEEF]

The 2022 SEC schedule is going to be announced tonight; not including UT and OU. Nothing is ever "final" but, to me, this more or less rules out the possibility that they will be exiting the Big 12 quickly and 2023 now would be the earliest. I think 2024 is probably most likely because that would coincide with the anticipated start of the SEC's new ESPN deal. I also think that the 2023 date negotiated with BYU and Houston for entrance more or less ruled out 2022, but tonight's announcement more or less confirms it as well.

Great! So can get 3 more wins against UT

 

[Bizarro Frog]

If the BIG 12 splits into divisions will they pull the SEC/ACC scheduling trick of 8 conference games? It makes it way easier to have a better conference record and make more teams become bowl eligible. It also helps qualify for the playoffs. Medium to bottom teams in the SEC/ACC can schedule 4 very winnable non-conference games then they only need to go 2-6 in conference to get to 6-6. It's one of the idiotic metrics they used against us in 2014 citing how many bowl eligible teams we beat. It also keeps more teams ranked because they don't knock each other off. Playing an 8 game conferenced schedule with 12 teams it allows you to play 3 cross division teams each year and you will play them all over 2 years. If the SEC keeps their 8 game schedule when TX and OU join they will only play the 7 non-permanent cross division teams once every 7 years. Ridiculous.

 

[Eight]

If the BIG 12 splits into divisions will they pull the SEC/ACC scheduling trick of 8 conference games? It makes it way easier to have a better conference record and make more teams become bowl eligible. It also helps qualify for the playoffs. Medium to bottom teams in the SEC/ACC can schedule 4 very winnable non-conference games then they only need to go 2-6 in conference to get to 6-6. It's one of the idiotic metrics they used against us in 2014 citing how many bowl eligible teams we beat. It also keeps more teams ranked because they don't knock each other off. Playing an 8 game conferenced schedule allows you to play 3 cross division teams so you play them all every 2 years. If the SEC keeps their 8 game schedule when TX and OU join they will only play the 7 non-permanent cross division teams once every 7 years. Ridiculous.

don't see how the big 12 doesn't split into divisions when OUT leaves and the new 4 join the conference.

agree that playing 8 conference games is a nice number and allows an easy rotation in football with the other division

really hope we don't see some type of forced rivalry game with teams in opposite divisions

also think it will be interesting to see how they handle scheduling for basketball and other sports

 

[Horned Toad]

don't see how the big 12 doesn't split into divisions when OUT leaves and the new 4 join the conference.

agree that playing 8 conference games is a nice number and allows an easy rotation in football with the other division

really hope we don't see some type of forced rivalry game with teams in opposite divisions

also think it will be interesting to see how they handle scheduling for basketball and other sports

I think BB should stay round robin while football follows the 8 conference game format in a division.

 

[Eight]

I think BB should stay round robin while football follows the 8 conference game format in a division.

noticed the big 10 plays 20 conference basketball games, acc and sec play 18, so it looks like most are playing the full round robin.

 

[This Ain't Chopped Liver]

noticed the big 10 plays 20 conference basketball games, acc and sec play 18, so it looks like most are playing the full round robin.

Isn't a full round robin in basketball playing each team twice, home and away? Doable with 12 teams in the Big 12, a 22 game conference schedule.

 

[Bizarro Frog]

The PAC 12 has the hardest road to the playoff with regards to scheduling besides the current BIG12. They play 9 conference games so they have a 67% chance of playing the other division champ in a rematch. BIG TEN plays 9 as well but they only have 42% of a rematch.

 

[Virginia Frog]

don't see how the big 12 doesn't split into divisions when OUT leaves and the new 4 join the conference.

agree that playing 8 conference games is a nice number and allows an easy rotation in football with the other division

really hope we don't see some type of forced rivalry game with teams in opposite divisions

also think it will be interesting to see how they handle scheduling for basketball and other sports

The main problem of (6 school) divisions in the B12 is :
a) All TX teams together or not, good or bad - potential controversy here.
b) If split naturally west-east the "Black and Blue" division will be the West (TT, OKSt, BYU, TCU, BYU and UH) and the "Lesser Than" division will be the East.
c) If 2 regular divisions then winners of each will be in ConfChampGame. Maybe not the two best teams that year.

Here's the solution of divisions in the B12:

Football only: Four "triads" for scheduling only. Optimal geography for the respective division members. These divisions don't exit in the standings.

SW Division (1)
TCU
Baylor
Houston

Western Division (2)
BYU
TXTech
OkieSt

Midwest Division (3)
IowaSt
KU
K-State

Eastern (time zone) Division (4)
WVU
Cinci
U Central Fla

8 B12 games annually, 4 home, 4 away, toggle biannually, per team.

Each division provides 2 "rivals" and both are geographically optimal within the conference. Each year one home, one away.

Each division plays 2 others in 2 year cycles (home/away) for 6 games. 3 home, 3 away each season.

With 8 in-conf games per year, minimize "beating up each other" weakening our collective records and poll standings. Use the SEC "strategy" to game the polls for the entire conference.

There should be ample inventory of 48 conference games for TV broadcast with 12 teams and the respective $$$.

This also frees up every B12 team for an extra OOC game that can be dedicated to a annual home & away non-conference "rival" or geographically-near school.
(TCU:SMU, IwSt:Iowa, BYU:Utah, UCF:South FL, Houston:Rice, WVitt-Kentucky-VaTech, OkSt:OU, KU:Mizzou, K-State/Nebraska?, Cinci:Lousiville- Memphis, TT:UTEP/NM/Colo/ColSt., etc.)

Then the 3 other OOC can be home bodybag (warm up, first game), a decent mid-level FBS team and a "stretch" FBS more top tier matchup. The respective ADs can do what they want with these 3 games as to competitive level and geographic area. This could give the B12 more nationwide exposure in the aggregate.

Year 1 & Year 2: (for home & away toggle)
Div. 1 plays Div2 & Div3, Div2 plays Div1 & Div4, Div 3 plays Div1 and 4, Div 4 plays Div2 and Div3.

Re-scramble for Years 3 & 4:
1 plays 2 & 4, 2 plays 1 & 3, 3 plays 2 & 4, and 4 plays 1 & 3.

Re-scramble again for Years 5 & 6:
1 plays 3 & 4, 2 plays 3 & 4 , 3 plays 1 & 2, 4 plays 1 & 2

This model is more dynamic than the quad system we had in the WAC back in the '90s. It's "everyone playing everyone" and for the Conference to be truly a conference with great inter-school/team familiarity/exposure/integration.

Standings will be conference-wide. No Division standings. Top 2 teams go to Conference Championship game. Since a tie could exist for #2 there must be clearly thought out rules to adjudicate that outcome.

Never play 9 conf. games unless the SEC does so.

 

[Eight]

The main problem of (6 school) divisions in the B12 is :
a) All TX teams together or not, good or bad - potential controversy here.
b) If split naturally west-east the "Black and Blue" division will be the West (TT, OKSt, BYU, TCU, BYU and UH) and the "Lesser Than" division will be the East.
c) If 2 regular divisions then winners of each will be in ConfChampGame. Maybe not the two best teams that year.

Here's the solution of divisions in the B12:

Football only: Four "triads" for scheduling only. Doesn't exit on any official paper or in the standings.

SW Division (1)
TCU
Baylor
Houston

Western Division (2)
BYU
TXTech
OkieSt

Midwest Division (3)
IowaSt
KU
K-State

Eastern (time zone) Division (4)
WVU
Cinci
U Central Fla

8 B12 games annually, 4 home, 4 away, toggle biannually, per team.

Each division provides 2 "rivals" and both are geographically optimal within the conference. Each year one home, one away.

Each division plays 2 others in 2 year cycles (home/away) for 6 games. 3 home, 3 away each season.

With 8 in-conf games per year, minimize "beating up each other" weakening our collective records and poll standings. Use the SEC "strategy" to game the polls for the entire conference.

There should be ample inventory of 48 conference games for TV broadcast with 12 teams and the respective $$$.

This also frees up every B12 team for an extra OOC game that can be dedicated to a annual home & away non-conference "rival" or geographically-near school.
(TCU:SMU, IwSt:Iowa, BYU:Utah, UCF:South FL, Houston:Rice, WVitt-Kentucky-VaTech, OkSt:OU, KU:Mizzou, K-State/Nebraska?, Cinci:Lousiville- Memphis, TT:UTEP/NM/Colo/ColSt., etc.)

Then the 3 other OOC can be home bodybag (warm up, first game), a decent mid-level FBS team and a "stretch" FBS more top tier matchup. The respective ADs can do what they want with these 3 games as to competitive level and geographic area. This could give the B12 more nationwide exposure in the aggregate.

Year 1 & Year 2: (for home & away toggle)
Div. 1 plays Div2 & Div3, Div2 plays Div1 & Div4, Div 3 plays Div1 and 4, Div 4 plays Div2 and Div3.

Re-scramble for Years 3 & 4:
1 plays 2 & 4, 2 plays 1 & 3, 3 plays 2 & 4, and 4 plays 1 & 3.

Re-scramble again for Years 5 & 6:
1 plays 3 & 4, 2 plays 3 & 4 , 3 plays 1 & 2, 4 plays 1 & 2

This model is more dynamic than the quad system we had in the WAC back in the '90s. It's "everyone playing everyone" and for the Conference to be truly a conference with great inter-school/team familiarity/exposure/integration.

Standings will be conference-wide. No Division standings. Top 2 teams go to Conference Championship game. Since a tie could exist for #2 there must be clearly thought out rules to adjudicate that outcome.

Never play 9 conf. games unless the SEC does so.

scheiss no.

anything that convoluted is going to implode in very short order

yes, there is going to be a difference in division strength, show me a conference that doesn't have this, so deal with it and don't make things too damn complicated with you scramble, rescramble, and scheissed up scramble again bull [ Finebaum ]

split it west, east, houston goes east done

 

[Virginia Frog]

scheiss no.

anything that convoluted is going to implode [ #2020 ]

split it west, east, houston goes east done

Don't agree. On paper it may seem "convoluted." It's not - pretty straightforward. It could unite the conference like the 9 game round robin did for us while at 10 teams. My opinion, your opinion. Difference is sometime a good thing!

Really the main points are: 1) 8 games like the SEC and 2) The conference game needs the best two teams each year. (The ACC has suffered several years with the "Division Champions meet in the Conf Championship" model.)

 

[Eight]

Don't agree. On paper it may seem "convoluted." It's not - pretty straightforward. It could unite the conference like the 9 game round robin did for us while at 10 teams. My opinion, your opinion. Difference is sometime a good thing!

Really the main points are: 1) 8 games like the SEC and 2) The conference game needs the best two teams each year. (The ACC has suffered several years with the "Division Champions meet in the Conf Championship" model.)

remind me which year the acc didn't have its champion in the cfp because the two best perceived teams didn't play in the ccg

 

[Virginia Frog]

split it west, east, houston goes east done

Houston goes EAST?

So 6: TCU, BU, TT, OkSt, BYU, K-St
then 6: KU, IwSt, Cin, WV, UCF and UH

Split K-St From KU, won't work

UH, is a Texas team, a drive-to game - split from TCU & Baylor. bad idea I believe. These three should play annually home and away -for everybody's benefit. Geography matters for attendance.

TT-OkSt-BYU-TCU-BU-UH works.

keeps K-St, KU and IwSt together (natural geography there)

 

[Virginia Frog]

remind me which year the acc didn't have its champion in the cfp because the two best perceived teams didn't play in the ccg

Now you're nit picking. Clemson seems to always be the champ of the ACC - and that's the point - they often do not have to face the ACCs 2nd best squad (not "perceived") in their ConfChampGame.

 

[Wexahu]

The PAC 12 has the hardest road to the playoff with regards to scheduling besides the current BIG12. They play 9 conference games so they have a 67% chance of playing the other division champ in a rematch. BIG TEN plays 9 as well but they only have 42% of a rematch.

The Pac 12 has the hardest road because it is the 5th best of five P5 leagues and they haven't had a really great team in the CFP era, not because of scheduling. A playoff worthy team should not have a problem winning that 9th conference game.

The "8 conference game" mantra is more for maximizing bowl-eligible teams than it is making it easier for a team to make the playoff. I know the argument that you supposedly have more ranked teams because they presumably have better records (which makes a playoff team resume better looking) but that is a very weak argument IMO, and isn't really based on reality.

 

[Eight]

Houston goes EAST?

So 6: TCU, BU, TT, OkSt, BYU, K-St
then 6: KU, IwSt, Cin, WV, UCF and UH

Split K-St From KU, won't work

UH, is a Texas team, a drive-to game - split from TCU & Baylor. bad idea I believe. These three should play annually home and away -for everybody's benefit. Geography matters for attendance.

still waiting for your answer on how the acc suffered by not having their "two best" teams playing in the ccg?

as far as houston, they should just be glad they got an invite and take what they get

put tcu, bu, tt, ok state iowa state, and byu in the "west"

you aren't going to get a geographically perfect conference with this make up of teams and the only real rivalry you have to protect is kanas vs ksu.

keep it simple, don't reshuffle, and i will wait for your answer on the acc since that was the example you wanted to use on how divisional misalignment could hurt a conference

 

[Eight]

Now you're nit picking. Clemson seems to always be the champ of the ACC - and that's the point - they often do not have to face the ACCs 2nd best squad (not "perceived") in their ConfChampGame.

nitpicking? believe two teams have actually represented the acc in the cfp and both teams have actually won titles, but why let facts get in the way and you should just shut down the rest because your are only make your case weaker and weaker

 

[Wexahu]

Now you're nit picking. Clemson seems to always be the champ of the ACC - and that's the point - they often do not have to face the ACCs 2nd best squad (not "perceived") in their ConfChampGame.

How many times have they not had to do that, and how big of a difference would that have really made? I bet in most of these years, they'd have been 2TD+ favorites in that game, maybe 20+ point favorites.

I don't get your point anyway. Why wouldn't they have to face the 2nd best team? They play everyone in their division + the winner of the other division. ???

 

[Virginia Frog]

still waiting for your answer on how the acc suffered by not having their "two best" teams playing in the ccg?

"Suffered" yes...all of college football fandom suffers when the 2 BEST teams are in any championship. The TV ratings (conceivably) are negatively effected by such lack of real competition (maybe that's too academic of an answer, but has a nugget of real truth.)

I think my proposal is a REAL GOOD ONE! You don't. O.K. I've got it.

Maybe some variation would be "best."

We're just FANS who have no IMPUT to the real outcome of this. OPINIONS, just opinions.

 

[CountryFrog]

The main problem of (6 school) divisions in the B12 is :
a) All TX teams together or not, good or bad - potential controversy here.
b) If split naturally west-east the "Black and Blue" division will be the West (TT, OKSt, BYU, TCU, BYU and UH) and the "Lesser Than" division will be the East.
c) If 2 regular divisions then winners of each will be in ConfChampGame. Maybe not the two best teams that year.

Here's the solution of divisions in the B12:

Football only: Four "triads" for scheduling only. Optimal geography for the respective division members. These divisions don't exit in the standings.

SW Division (1)
TCU
Baylor
Houston

Western Division (2)
BYU
TXTech
OkieSt

Midwest Division (3)
IowaSt
KU
K-State

Eastern (time zone) Division (4)
WVU
Cinci
U Central Fla

8 B12 games annually, 4 home, 4 away, toggle biannually, per team.

Each division provides 2 "rivals" and both are geographically optimal within the conference. Each year one home, one away.

Each division plays 2 others in 2 year cycles (home/away) for 6 games. 3 home, 3 away each season.

With 8 in-conf games per year, minimize "beating up each other" weakening our collective records and poll standings. Use the SEC "strategy" to game the polls for the entire conference.

There should be ample inventory of 48 conference games for TV broadcast with 12 teams and the respective $$$.

This also frees up every B12 team for an extra OOC game that can be dedicated to a annual home & away non-conference "rival" or geographically-near school.
(TCU:SMU, IwSt:Iowa, BYU:Utah, UCF:South FL, Houston:Rice, WVitt-Kentucky-VaTech, OkSt:OU, KU:Mizzou, K-State/Nebraska?, Cinci:Lousiville- Memphis, TT:UTEP/NM/Colo/ColSt., etc.)

Then the 3 other OOC can be home bodybag (warm up, first game), a decent mid-level FBS team and a "stretch" FBS more top tier matchup. The respective ADs can do what they want with these 3 games as to competitive level and geographic area. This could give the B12 more nationwide exposure in the aggregate.

Year 1 & Year 2: (for home & away toggle)
Div. 1 plays Div2 & Div3, Div2 plays Div1 & Div4, Div 3 plays Div1 and 4, Div 4 plays Div2 and Div3.

Re-scramble for Years 3 & 4:
1 plays 2 & 4, 2 plays 1 & 3, 3 plays 2 & 4, and 4 plays 1 & 3.

Re-scramble again for Years 5 & 6:
1 plays 3 & 4, 2 plays 3 & 4 , 3 plays 1 & 2, 4 plays 1 & 2

This model is more dynamic than the quad system we had in the WAC back in the '90s. It's "everyone playing everyone" and for the Conference to be truly a conference with great inter-school/team familiarity/exposure/integration.

Standings will be conference-wide. No Division standings. Top 2 teams go to Conference Championship game. Since a tie could exist for #2 there must be clearly thought out rules to adjudicate that outcome.

Never play 9 conf. games unless the SEC does so.

You might be over thinking it. Simpler is better with this stuff. If one division is stronger than the other so be it.