1. The KillerFrogs

FWST: TCU coaches, AD reduce salaries amid coronavirus pandemic

Discussion in 'Scott & Wes Frog Fan Forum' started by TopFrog, May 15, 2020.

  1. I have run into a few recent graduates who want(ed) to get into this field but once they found out it was a sales job, passed on it. From what I can tell, that is one job where who you know is way, way more important than what you know.
    jake102 and Eight like this.
  2. I know you said it's just hypothetical but it's very possible TCU enrollment will be down 20% or maybe more in the fall.
  3. Interesting take...my experience suggests that many and perhaps most of said prof’s experience very high levels of insecurity about their ability to compete for and subsequently succeed in jobs outside of academia. And...this holds true for many who are paid consultants for the very businesses they aren’t sure they could do well in.

    As always there are very notable exceptions (and I had several exceptions during my EMBA program)
  4. the ability to communicate with people and gain their trust is significant, but as 4th down points out there is a disconnect between the universities / colleges and business
  5. Just an observation... a wide swath of folks are getting thrown under the bus here, in some cases not via personal observation but rather a generalized concept of what a college professor represents.

    I bet however that there are many of us here who took on a great deal of study, time, investment and effort to get to a certain point in our lives or careers. If you fit this description, you are probably proud of what you've accomplished and may even hold your field in a higher regard than outsiders do. Understandable, as you realize exactly it takes to succeed in your field where others may not. This is not unique to college profs.

    Many of us would be upset with reductions in the salary and benefits we have contracted for, especially when based on an external event that you had no control over. In fact, this is happening a lot currently. I see TONS of people in fields that aren't education who are changing behaviors, opinions, and even ignoring governmental orders because of their frustration. They are celebrated, but these professors can't complain?

    Those professors who feel the timing is arbitrary and/or an excuse MAY NOT BE RIGHT, but it doesn't mean their perception is very far off at all from what many of us would have felt in a similar situation. They didn't just show up and apply for that job from the unemployment line. They often dedicated 6 to 10 years of their life qualifying for it, and many more decades perfecting and adapting their craft. So just take a moment before piling on more criticism, and think about whether you are commenting on strawmen, would be my suggestion.
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  6. I don't think taking to Twitter to air frustrations on having your 401k reduced is the right response. I'll probably lose~10% of my total comp this year, but I'm pretty happy to still have a job.
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  7. That was me, but for an internship. I basically laughed when they offered me a job and gave me a contacts book at the same time. No way I'm hitting up my family, friends and relatives to sell your garbage.
    Shorty and Eight like this.
  8. And I think you're right about this one aspect of that. I wish the criticism here from others were so limited in scope.
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  9. That's not what they're anticipating and their goal for committed in-coming freshmen (2200+) is very close to being met.
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  10. no one has said they don't have a right to be frustrated, but two things stand out to me

    first, the idea that a few are so tone deaf to the idea that an open forum such as twitter is the proper place to complain especially with almost 2M texans filing for unemployment the past two months.

    tcu as a school is viewed by some as not the norm economically and to some that comes across as a very much let them eat cake attitude

    additionally, i have known former colleagues who were terminated for airing their feelings out loud on conference calls and meetings which are far more private than social media and two staff members from my wife's hospital were let go last fall for using facebook as an avenue to express dissatisfaction with the system.

    i mentioned earlier i have worked for 4-5 firms that regularly monitored your social media

    second, while time and mastery should theoretically mean something of value i have seen the opposite in a number of cases and it sure as heck doesn't always guarantee a level of income.

    what is more troubling about this to me is not the belief that mastery and tenure should guarantee one's position and financial stake but that these are the people who are supposedly preparing their students to prepare for the "outside" world when they operate in a world of completely different rules.

    as i have referenced to the young attorney and the wanna be financial planner they both were advanced in their subject matter knowledge, but knew nothing about their business
  11. A good portion of those that teach in higher ed have never once held a job in the private sector within their field. All of their "study, time, investment and effort" has been towards earning a piece of paper that validates their time spent with their noses in books or writing papers. Not to say that learning at a high level shouldn't be lauded--or required for certain professions, but when it comes to the practical application of what they're teaching, all of their degrees and theoretical knowledge means very little. A good example is in my field of graphic design.

    Students who go to a 4 year university to learn graphic design simply learn theory, while their professors expect the student to figure out the technical aspects of taking a theorized design and bringing it to life in a program like Illustrator or Photoshop on their own. Students that go though our 2 year program learn the technical skills in building designs and comps but are rarely taught the theory. When these two students meet in the job market all we ever hear from employers is how they'd rather employ our students than someone from UTA, UNT or TCU. Our students have the practical knowledge and can be taught the theory, but the other students come out of a 4 year program thinking they know it all but can't make the simplest of designs in the programs required to succeed in the field. This is one of the biggest problems with higher ed today, teachers that have a lot of knowledge but were never required to apply that knowledge to better prepare students for the job... unless the job is to teach.
    Eight likes this.
  12. There may well be a BIG difference between "committed in-coming freshmen" and the number who actually arrive on campus in August. Almost all of the Universities have a pretty good "committed in coming freshmen" list, but almost all are worrying about how many get there in August.
    4th. down and Eight like this.
  13. The balance of education versus experience that you mention is one that multiple fields face, yours being one of them. Very intelligent people can disagree on which is better or in what ratio. What is best for one industry may not be the best in another. In some fields, like I suspect yours, the practical application is more important. In others, it's detailed theoretical knowledge. I don't know that one is essentially better than the other. Depends on context.

    But in my experience and having known several profs from our school personally, I don't necessarily agree with the generalization that most profs (I'm sorry, a "good portion", however you'd like to define that) don't have any experience in the field. My father for an example worked for UT Southwestern in a non-teaching position for years before TCU called. The degrees they possess allow them multiple opportunities, only one of which is teaching. It might be looked at as the easy one, and maybe why many with those qualifications gravitate to teaching over time as they get frustrated with whatever politics and irritations are in an applied field.

    Are there exceptions? Absolutely. There are people who go from GA to get their doctorate and go right back into teaching. Some teach while simultaneously working on projects and research within the field. But I'd have to see actual data before I believe your generalization that a "good portion" are book-learned only. It sounds anecdotal.
  14. Your response here indicates you are much more of a snowflake than those PC cops you think are ruining the world.

    As for your examples, the Jungle Book is a great example of our point... It's a great movie and was beloved at the time of its release. There is no problem with watching it today, and I'd show it to my kids.

    However, the reality of it is A) It's based on a book/story written by a white supremacist and, B) Has the monkeys in the movie speak in jive, played by all black actors, and talk about wishing they were human. We should NOT rewrite and rejudge the move that was released in the sixties based on today's values, but, for instance, you would never make that movie in that same way today because we realize that the context and subtext of parts of that movie aren't great. Society improves, matures, gets better, and we all must march forward. It's the good part of progress.
  15. #95 Eight, May 19, 2020
    Last edited: May 19, 2020
    believe about me as you wish, but curious. which cartoons then?

    i agree, the italian american immigrants should be furious how they were portrayed in that movie

    i would have suggested veggie tales but those have a religious bent soooooo....what then?

    oh, and far as society improving and maturing keep telling yourself that, each generation does and yet the same problems continue to plague the enlightened world each generation
  16. Humanity will never remove every problem in the world, as long as selfish individuals exist.

    But if you're telling yourself there is no progress being made... with many issues I think you're wrong. Lowest hanging fruit example - nobody really talked about sexual harassment 100 years ago, in fact, society looked at certain actions as "boys being boys", i.e. it was somehow acceptable. Then at some point a phrase was coined. Then later, more segments of society say "this might be an issue". Eventually MeToo happens, and while that pendulum may swing a little too far sometimes, I'd bet you dollars to donuts that sexual harassment is far less common today than when we began this example.
  17. yes, we are addressing issues such as sexual harassment but when you point to the metoo that is a very interesting event because one person fell in hollywood, but how many remain in place? how many are still in places of authority?

    heck, some of those behind the metoo movement believe roman polanski should be allowed to return to the us without fear of being arrested.

    progress is nice and yet human trafficking is as big a problem as ever in the world and those who are being trafficked i'd bet dollars to donuts for their house cleaning skills

    don't get me wrong, i believe each day we should try to make the world a better place, but we are kidding ourselves if we think we really are better than our ancestors from a moral perspective
  18. Let me just skip all the paragraphs of BS we can both generate and say that you see an apple and I see an orange. Considering evil people are born among the good people everyday, and that our lifespans are finite, incremental improvements may be the best we ever achieve. I say that's a good thing. You say that's irrelevant. We clearly disagree.
  19. irrelevant? no, but as you said we see this differently

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