Frogs vs Raiders Hoops Game Thread

[westoverhillbilly]

Unfortunately, I was one of a few frog fans in attendance last night and our young guys just didn't handle the loudness well, but they'll get adjusted and Jaime will figure this out.. Tech's guard play was unbelievable last night..

 

[tetonfrog]

Oh and I would love to see what Archie could have done with Nembhard's minutes.

I understand the angst regarding JF. He worked so hard and played well for us, but I don't understand all the love for Archie.

He was only about himself. He refused to sacrifice for the team. He did not just want RJ's minutes, He wanted to start, play 40 minutes and take 25 shots a game when he is limited on offense. When Dixon told him he was not going to get to do that, he left.

Now, he will get to do that at UTEP. Best of luck to him, but I wish our fans would move on. We have a bunch of guys busting their asses off and we get all these "I wish (fill in the blank) was here."

Do you really believe that Archie was going to score 20 points and spark a rally at Tech? If so, why? His jump shot is no better than RJ's and worse that ARob's IMO.

 

[flyfishingfrog]

well the funny thing is that with the exception of Fisher, none of the guys we lost were even close to helping offensively - yet our offensive is what seems to have tanked since Hawaii. And really Fisher was helpful some but he missed a ton of this year even before he came back.

I am not sure what the deal is with why we have suddenly lost our ability to do anything on offense other than we just run around and don't seem to actually execute anything.

Tech scored about 20 last night on guys cutting through the lane and getting them the ball - we didn't score any doing that.

 

[MTfrog5]

I understand the angst regarding JF. He worked so hard and played well for us, but I don't understand all the love for Archie.

He was only about himself. He refused to sacrifice for the team. He did not just want RJ's minutes, He wanted to start, play 40 minutes and take 25 shots a game when he is limited on offense. When Dixon told him he was not going to get to do that, he left.

Now, he will get to do that at UTEP. Best of luck to him, but I wish our fans would move on. We have a bunch of guys busting their asses off and we get all these "I wish (fill in the blank) was here."

Do you really believe that Archie was going to score 20 points and spark a rally at Tech? If so, why? His jump shot is no better than RJ's and worse that ARob's IMO.

I think the feeling is he can’t be worse on offense, better defender and rebounder than RJ so yeah I would have liked to see what Archie could have done. If he did well then start him like RJ did when Fisher stopped playing. I think it’s funny when people compare freshman to Robinson. I really hope a 5th year senior is a better than these red shirt and true freshman. It took until his 5th year to develop somewhat of a jump shot so maybe we could give these guys more than half a season of playing to develop on offense.

 

[jake102]

but I wish our fans would move on. We have a bunch of guys busting their asses off and we get all these "I wish (fill in the blank) was here."

Obviously I wish Archie had the attitude, that would be necessary for him to take Nembhard's minutes. But that's on Dixon, he recruits the players.

And no, I don't think Archie would have helped us win that game, but there's no doubt he had some serious athletic ability. If nothing else he can disrupt a game with athleticism and we aren't getting much of anything from Nembhard, not much downside risk.

I don't really care how hard the guys are trying, that's kind of what you do in sports. It's all about winning

 

[Wexahu]

Hate to say this, but we don't look like a well-coached team.

 

[tetonfrog]

Interesting how quick some fans are ready to turn on Dixon. We can let go to UCLA and hire Billy Gillespie. How does that sound?

 

[jake102]

Interesting how quick some fans are ready to turn on Dixon. We can let go to UCLA and hire Billy Gillespie. How does that sound?

At what point has anyone said that?

I will never understand the grossly wild overreactions that stem from overreactions.

*Pick a TCU sport where we lose a game*
Overreaction #1 - XYZ Coach needs to do a better job, looks like we didn't even prepare
Gross overreaction #2 - I can't believe you want to fire XYZ Coach.

 

[Wexahu]

Interesting how quick some fans are ready to turn on Dixon. We can let go to UCLA and hire Billy Gillespie. How does that sound?

I don't think anyone is "turning on" JD at this point. But I don't see how anyone can watch this team and think we execute like a well-coached team. We don't. Way too many stupid, careless mistakes and we'll continue to be a middle-of-the pack, borderline NCAA team until it gets fixed. And I understand that is still pretty good relative to the program's history but there is no doubt expectation levels have been raised, and I don't think unfairly given what the coach is paid and the money pumped into the program.

 

[Big Frog II]

Having a healthy Fisher out there would cure a lot of our problems. Since that isn't happening, we are just going to have to take some lumps here and there until our freshmen get older and new talent arrives.

 

[tetonfrog]

At what point has anyone said that?

I will never understand the grossly wild overreactions that stem from overreactions.

*Pick a TCU sport where we lose a game*
Overreaction #1 - XYZ Coach needs to do a better job, looks like we didn't even prepare
Gross overreaction #2 - I can't believe you want to fire XYZ Coach.

And I will never understand why TCU fans always complain about our most successful coaches.

You questioned his recruiting and others have questioned his offensive strategy. And there have a been a [ Finebaum ]load of fans questioning why four players transferred out. Everyone is pointing their fingers at JD.

That is a lot of grumbling for a team that is 15-5. That is my point. Find someone who is going to do better and let me know. That is not an overreaction. It is perspective.

 

[jake102]

Find someone who is going to do better and let me know.

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/rankings

I have zero interest in finding a replacement for Dixon, (or Patterson or Schloss or Roditi) but they aren't perfect. This is a freaking sports forum, it's like the point.

 

[CountryFrog]

The only thing I'll blame Dixon for this season is not fixing Fisher's knees.

He's clearly not perfect but neither is any other coach, and ultimately, you're only as good of a coach as the players that you put on the floor. Just gotta keep getting the talent in here and hope that we don't have mass losses again like we did this season. This is a good team and a good program. I think we would've competed for the B12 title if we'd stayed healthy but that's sports sometimes. People get hurt and people transfer.

 

[flyfishingfrog]

And I will never understand why TCU fans always complain about our most successful coaches.

You questioned his recruiting and others have questioned his offensive strategy. And there have a been a [ steaming pile of Orgeron ]load of fans questioning why four players transferred out. Everyone is pointing their fingers at JD.

That is a lot of grumbling for a team that is 15-5. That is my point. Find someone who is going to do better and let me know. That is not an overreaction. It is perspective.

I don't disagree with you - but if you have been watching all year, it is obvious something has happened the last few weeks

Some of that is we are actually playing good basketball teams now vs that crap we played in non-con - which may be part of the problem. That 15-5 stat is worthless and everyone that follows basketball knows it. It was why we had the best record in D1 for unranked teams at one point.

What matters is we are 3-4 in conference. We play in a league where winning at home and trying to steal one on the road is vital to making the tournament and getting a good, if not great seed. And our conference is in a little of a down year or at least one where it is up for grabs.

The issue with this team - regardless of how we got here - is that we seem to be more likely to drop a home game than steal one of the road at the moment. Tech and KSU were blow outs that the team was never in and we held on by our fingernails against our last three home opponents.

I have no idea if JD pushed guys out, if they left because they are cry babies, if Fishers knee is bionic and he would have been back or if he will never play again or if Archie was the next Dr J.

What I know is the guys we have on the team and our coaches need to figure out how to get back to the point where we are a threat to score more and we all need to hope the lack of D we showed against Tech was just a bad night. However Tech supposedly runs the same offense as we do - and they ran it a lot better than we have all year - so there is room for improvement somewhere.

 

[tetonfrog]

- so there is room for improvement somewhere.

I definitely agree with this. Frogs were lousy last night. Period. I am sure JD agrees with all us on this. Just tired of hearing all of the pot shots he has been taking the last couple of games. With the exception of JF, the other guys who left were spares.

The biggest thing he needs to do before Saturday is energize Arob and JD. They looked exhausted last night. We can't have that and expect to win in Waco or Ames or even on our home floor in league play.

Hope the guys can pull it together and the days off help them get their legs back.

 

[Eight]

I definitely agree with this. Frogs were lousy last night. Period. I am sure JD agrees with all us on this. Just tired of hearing all of the pot shots he has been taking the last couple of games. With the exception of JF, the other guys who left were spares.

The biggest thing he needs to do before Saturday is energize Arob and JD. They looked exhausted last night. We can't have that and expect to win in Waco or Ames or even on our home floor in league play.

Hope the guys can pull it together and the days off help them get their legs back.

interesting, archie, alok, and macwilliams are all spares and yet you make the point to say arob and jd looked exhausted and in need of rest.

archie averaged just over 10 minutes a game and alok 13 minutes a game while they were on the roster. neither generated many points, but they did lessen the work load a bit and i am curious if the drop in effectiveness we have seen from alex and jd wouldn't have been diminished if some of those minutes hadn't been picked up.

i also think alex is wearing down from having to create for a large portion of the shot clock with so many possessions a game. there is no doubt the ball isn't moving as effectively as earlier in the year and the offense has gotten much more dependent on the dribble versus passing the ball.

 

[LawFrog504]

We may have a "motion offense" on paper but we do absolutely nothing in terms of productive motion, such a curling around picks and receiving the ball while moving towards the bucket. Our motion consists of players trading places from the wing to the corner and cycling the ball around the perimeter until ARob makes a play on a high P&R or a turnover. Any pass directed towards a cutter is by happenstance as opposed to a part of the motion of the offense. Was hoping Cross could bring some creativity to our "offense" since he seemed to work magic at UTA but that hasn't happened as we've seen the same thing for three years. Our talent level will continue to improve for the next few years and you can always be pretty good with good defense and rebounding, but I'm not seeing a lot of creativity on that side of the ball. Hell, we don't even look like we have inbound plays.

PS
The best we've looked all year offensively was early in the year against a couple of crappy zones with Alex or JD flashing to the high post. It kept Arob from dribbling the clock out and allowed him to use his fantastic passing skills to find open shooters or the low post cutting to the bucket. Granted, the teams that played zone against us weren't great, but I liked what I saw much better in terms of ball movement and a coherent plan.

This is absolutely dead on. We do not run offense other than pass it around the 3 point line 6 times and run a PNR with AR with 6 seconds left on the shot clock. This was the knock on Dixon at Pitt and it's still holding true. The fact of the matter is that this is much more indicative of how game (s) in the tournament will be, and we have shown zero ability to score consistently in these instances. Syracuse exposed the hell out of this last year and Tech made us look silly last night

 

[LawFrog504]

interesting, archie, alok, and macwilliams are all spares and yet you make the point to say arob and jd looked exhausted and in need of rest.

archie averaged just over 10 minutes a game and alok 13 minutes a game while they were on the roster. neither generated many points, but they did lessen the work load a bit and i am curious if the drop in effectiveness we have seen from alex and jd wouldn't have been diminished if some of those minutes hadn't been picked up.

i also think alex is wearing down from having to create for a large portion of the shot clock with so many possessions a game. there is no doubt the ball isn't moving as effectively as earlier in the year and the offense has gotten much more dependent on the dribble versus passing the ball.

Agreed on this as well. Anyone who said we wouldn't miss Archie should be banned from this board. Who cares if he can't shoot yet? He's by far the most athletic guy on this roster and played hard, played defense, and allowed everyone to stay fresh

 

[jake102]

The pass around triangle on the 3pt line is definitely tiresome. We throw 5-6 passes that get us literally nowhere, and occasionally end in a TO. It was all fun and games when we played bad teams that eventually broke down and let us easily drive the ball, but Big 12 teams aren't fooled.

I also do not understand the concept when we in-bound the ball. The player in-bounding (let's say Miller) throws it to ARob who dribbles it about to half-court then passes it up to Bane, who immediately throws it back to the trailing Miller right as he crosses half-court who then passes it back to ARob. It's mind bottling to me why we do it... doesn't really matter one way or another, just confuses me.

 

[Wexahu]

I definitely agree with this. Frogs were lousy last night. Period. I am sure JD agrees with all us on this. Just tired of hearing all of the pot shots he has been taking the last couple of games. With the exception of JF, the other guys who left were spares.

The biggest thing he needs to do before Saturday is energize Arob and JD. They looked exhausted last night. We can't have that and expect to win in Waco or Ames or even on our home floor in league play.

Hope the guys can pull it together and the days off help them get their legs back.

I wouldn't say they were spares, I'd say those losses pretty much derailed any chance of a "great" season. They maybe weren't as good as we hoped they'd be, but they were still guys that had some ability and played some minutes. And if any other program was losing players at the rate we are, we'd all be wondering what is going on.

Guys are going to be exhausted because we have almost no depth. That's where losing 4 players, even if they were role players at best, hurts.