ESPN article about SWC's demise

[tetonfrog]

I moved to Jackson Hole in '99 from FW. Jackson is like Lawrence, KS - a blue city in a very conservative state. Teton County was the only Wyoming county to vote blue for President in each of Bush's election years.

My friends always asked about why Texas supported George Bush so heavily. I told them that I voted for Bush for Governor and would do it again every time. They were shocked because I supported the Green Party/Ralph Nader ticket for President.

I laughed at them and told them about the breakup of the SWC and how TCU was kicked to the curb. I told them how back-door politics and Gov. Ann Richards allowed Baylor into the Big 12 and how every TCU, SMU, UH and Rice fan voted for Bush. The lesson that the Democrats needed to learn was to never ever let a liberal woman mess with Texas football. I am not sure they have learned that.

 

[Big Frog II]

Rice? Really? All kidding aside I too think some of the PAC-12 teams will be ripe for the picking especially after what they've gone through this year.

 

[Endless Purple]

I don't care. That stuff is overrated. If a conference's sole and #1 objective is to guarantee it's football teams have a certain number of wins every year, something is screwed up. Does it really matter if 6-6 Minnesota makes some [ Cumbie’s red zone playcalling ]ty bowl game and 5-7 Texas Tech doesn't?

Your just figuring this out?

edit: the bolded part does not stand out too well: something is screwed up

 

[Endless Purple]

Think about it another way, Big 10 bringing in Rutgers + Maryland basically guarantees their conference opponents +1 win every season. Doesn't necessarily matter to Ohio states and Oklahoma's of the world who are in the hunt to go undefeated every year anyway. But does skew the 2nd tier teams win totals upwards, creating more ranked matchups and resume builders during the season, which helps the top teams playoff resumes and overall conference perceptions.

Just looking at last year in the big 12, the #3 and #4 teams in the final standings were Kstate and Texas at 8-4 each, barely top 25 records or just on the outside looking in. Lets say instead of losses to TCU or Oklahoma State, they each played cupcake Colorado state or New Mexico. Final records would be 9-3 and firmly top 25 teams, which would give the conference 4 top 25 teams instead of 2.

There is something too this. Though I personally think the 10 team option and round robin play is by far the best option, that is not the way things are set up with the system.

A conference is basically judged by the top couple teams. No one cares about how many patsies are in the Big 10 every year if Ohio St is in the playoff running.

A couple mid range teams in good markets is not bad. Cincy would be good many years, big city, and right at Ohio States doorstep for the Big 12.

 

[BrewingFrog]

los cruces if we are going for enchiladas

Drove through it a few times, but never stopped.

It seems that more research is called for!

 

[Bizarro Frog]

I was expecting commentary on the enchiladas aspect, but no matter...

New Mexico Mexican food has some beautiful heat to it. I love Tex Mex but most all of the heat has been removed to an almost zero level.

 

[BrewingFrog]

New Mexico Mexican food has some beautiful heat to it. I love Tex Mex but most all of the heat has been removed to an almost zero level.

Depends on where one dines, I suppose. In my old town, there were quite a few smaller places that were very, very tasty! But, I'm sure that Little Lina the Tyrant has snuffed the life out of all of them by now. Sigh...

 

[Zubaz]

New Mexico Mexican food has some beautiful heat to it. I love Tex Mex but most all of the heat has been removed to an almost zero level.

Green Chile is life. I've lived in Albuquerque for 13 years now, I can't imagine going without it.

 

[BrewingFrog]

Green Chile is life. I've lived in Albuquerque for 13 years now, I can't imagine going without it.

Green Chilies rule.

 

[DubaiFrog]

There is something too this. Though I personally think the 10 team option and round robin play is by far the best option, that is not the way things are set up with the system.

A conference is basically judged by the top couple teams. No one cares about how many patsies are in the Big 10 every year if Ohio St is in the playoff running.

A couple mid range teams in good markets is not bad. Cincy would be good many years, big city, and right at Ohio States doorstep for the Big 12.

I like the 10 team round robin as well, but it sets up the conference for failure using the playoff committee's "metrics". Granted those metrics change depending on the story they are trying to spin each year, however ranked teams + bowl eligible teams in the conference are pretty consistently cited from year to year. Having 1-2 additional ranked teams + adding 1-2 bowl game qualifiers to the conference can't hurt.

The Arizona schools accomplish this too, they are both consistently 6-8 win teams in the P12 and would probably maintain in the big 12. However they might be at the expense of an existing Big 12 school if they were added.

 

[BrewingFrog]

I like the 10 team round robin as well, but it sets up the conference for failure using the playoff committee's "metrics". Granted those metrics change depending on the story they are trying to spin each year, however ranked teams + bowl eligible teams in the conference are pretty consistently cited from year to year. Having 1-2 additional ranked teams + adding 1-2 bowl game qualifiers to the conference can't hurt.

The Arizona schools accomplish this too, they are both consistently 6-8 win teams in the P12 and would probably maintain in the big 12. However they might be at the expense of an existing Big 12 school if they were added.

I nominate Rape U. to be kicked to the curb. Can I get a second?

 

[Eight]

Green Chilies rule.

one could die from coronary blockage before they ate at all the places with great green chili cheese burgers in the area of las cruces and hatch

 

[Wexahu]

I like the 10 team round robin as well, but it sets up the conference for failure using the playoff committee's "metrics". Granted those metrics change depending on the story they are trying to spin each year, however ranked teams + bowl eligible teams in the conference are pretty consistently cited from year to year. Having 1-2 additional ranked teams + adding 1-2 bowl game qualifiers to the conference can't hurt.

The Arizona schools accomplish this too, they are both consistently 6-8 win teams in the P12 and would probably maintain in the big 12. However they might be at the expense of an existing Big 12 school if they were added.

The metrics have been very consistent through all 7 years of the CFP's existence. Don't want to get into it (again), but damn, what you're saying is just not true.

If there is ever a dispute between 2 or 3 teams P5 teams for the #4 spot.

1. 13-0 teams are in.
2. 12-1 conference champions make it over 11-1 teams
3. 11-1 teams make it over 2-loss conference champions
4. 12-0 teams make it over 1-loss conference champions

Debate the way it should be, but the committee has been 100% consistent every year. The metrics haven't changed at all.

 

[denverfrog]

The article says the demise of SWC killed the small schools...

“The exception was TCU. The Horned Frogs moved from the WAC to Conference USA to the Mountain West, culminating with a Rose Bowl win over Wisconsin in 2011. That success made them attractive when the Big 12 sought new members during the 2010-11 realignment cycle.”

Rice was already dead and never wanted to revive themselves. SMU killed themselves. Self inflicted. Arguably, the demise of the SWC actually saved TCU. It woke us up

 

[BrewingFrog]

one could die from coronary blockage before they ate at all the places with great green chili cheese burgers in the area of las cruces and hatch

"Could..." But one would go happily.

 

[LSU Game Attendee]

I nominate Rape U. to be kicked to the curb. Can I get a second?

Still employed by Baylor: https://www.baylor.edu/Judicial_Affairs/index.php?id=952812

 

[Spike]

12 Schools is a nice size. Divisions, Championship Game, all that. But, the reason two more schools are needed is to have some patsies. An easy win for everybody else. Makes the whole Conference look better. Allows you to fill out your Bowl berths with ease.

Rice and New Mexico. Bring 'em.

I don't want to add anyone unless they bring something. Don't want to not play OU/OSU every year to play Rice.

UH would be decent IMHO. Not sure who else.

 

[DubaiFrog]

The metrics have been very consistent through all 7 years of the CFP's existence. Don't want to get into it (again), but damn, what you're saying is just not true.

If there is ever a dispute between 2 or 3 teams P5 teams for the #4 spot.

1. 13-0 teams are in.
2. 12-1 conference champions make it over 11-1 teams
3. 11-1 teams make it over 2-loss conference champions
4. 12-0 teams make it over 1-loss conference champions

Debate the way it should be, but the committee has been 100% consistent every year. The metrics haven't changed at all.

Big 12 champ will have to go 12-1 or 13-0 to make the playoff, never said that would change.

Adding patsies helps the upper and mid tier teams boost their resume's. If TCU had a win over Colorado state instead of a 21-14 loss vs Kstate, we'd be on the verge of being ranked right now at 5-3. And OU would be ranked about 5th-6th at 7-1 right outside of the playoff conversation, instead of 11th at 6-2.

 

[Wexahu]

Big 12 champ will have to go 12-1 or 13-0 to make the playoff, never said that would change.

Adding patsies helps the upper and mid tier teams boost their resume's. If TCU had a win over Colorado state instead of a 21-14 loss vs Kstate, we'd be on the verge of being ranked right now at 5-3. And OU would be ranked about 5th-6th at 7-1 right outside of the playoff conversation, instead of 11th at 6-2.

As a fan, I want to see as many good games as reasonably possible. If my team is good, it's going to win most of those games and it's going to be really fun to watch. This thinking where you do anything you can to try and artificially boost your ranking by adding games against [ Finebaum ]ty teams, at the expense of playing good competitive games makes no sense to me.

As for us potentially being ranked right now if we had beaten Colorado State instead of losing to K-State, I don't really care about that either. We aren't one of the best 25 teams in the country, I can see that with my eyes when I watch games. Some artificial ranking based on beating a bunch of junk teams isn't something to strive for IMO.

 

[Eight]

Big 12 champ will have to go 12-1 or 13-0 to make the playoff, never said that would change.

Adding patsies helps the upper and mid tier teams boost their resume's. If TCU had a win over Colorado state instead of a 21-14 loss vs Kstate, we'd be on the verge of being ranked right now at 5-3. And OU would be ranked about 5th-6th at 7-1 right outside of the playoff conversation, instead of 11th at 6-2.

we need to water down the level of competition in the big 12 because 4-5 kansas state was too tough for us?