• The KillerFrogs

Dalton to replace Brady???

Zubaz

Member
1). I honestly think all the talk about Brady leaving is just noise. The only way he's leaving the Pats is if he retires, and I don't think he wants to retire on this note.

2). Whoever follows Brady, whenever he does hang it up, is in an impossible position. Love Andy, but he's not Steve Young. He'd be crucified in NE for no reason other than "he's not as good as the undisputed greatest QB of all time".
 

jake102

Active Member
Good luck throwing to Edelman and the worst supporting cast in the NFL. If NE doesn't commit to upgrading the WR and TE positions I do think Brady is gone.
 

Purp

Active Member
1). I honestly think all the talk about Brady leaving is just noise. The only way he's leaving the Pats is if he retires, and I don't think he wants to retire on this note.

2). Whoever follows Brady, whenever he does hang it up, is in an impossible position. Love Andy, but he's not Steve Young. He'd be crucified in NE for no reason other than "he's not as good as the undisputed greatest QB of all time".
I don't think Brady is the "undisputed" GQBOAT. I think there is a lot of debate.
 

hometown frog

Active Member
Brady posted a message earlier this week that he is coming back to play. So now they question is if he comes back to the Pats or gets paid somewhere else.
 

Purp

Active Member
Disaster of a take. It's not even close anymore
Drew Brees' season and records paired with the prospect of Tom retiring seems to have revived the debate. If you're looking purely are postseason numbers there is no debate. But those aren't the only numbers being used.

For QBs stats like total yards, total completions, career completion percentage, passing TDs, and QBR combine to give a picture of individual performance and effectiveness. Brees beats Brady in every one of those metrics. In the first 4 of those stats Drew Brees is #1 all time and in QBR he's 3rd behind Rodgers and Wilson.

The stats Brady beats Brees in are the ones oriented around team performance more than individual performance. If you're evaluating the greatest QB of all time which stats do you use? The ones more reflective of the QBs influence on the outcome of the games rather than the other 52 guys' influence on the outcome of the games? That's the debate and that's why there is apparently dispute.

Honestly, I think Manning was better than both of them, but I'm not the one debating. It's just my opinion that if you let Peyton, Drew, and Tom play their entire careers in NE with all other things being equal I think Peyton end up with better stats than all of them. But that's an opinion and probably why it's not said much by talking heads.

The empirical data suggests Brees has been a better QB over his career to those who value the individual stats over team stats in their evaluation. That's why the debate seems to have resurfaced.
 

CountryFrog

Active Member
I haven't heard of very many people debating whether Brees or Brady are better. That's a pretty clear cut and straight forward choice. If you talk about stats and what might happen swapping people from team to team, the one thing that you have to consider is weather. Brady played 10 games per year in Foxboro, New York, and Buffalo. All of which are notorious for windy and cold conditions that make throwing very difficult. Compare that to guys like Brees and Manning who played over half their games every year in domes. That alone has statistical impacts that can't really be measured.

Brady also had to win with mostly middling skill talent. He had a few years with Gronk but really no WR's that scared people outside of the one year with Moss. And in that one year with Moss, Brady put up absolutely insane numbers.
 

CountryFrog

Active Member
@CountryFrog -- Good points. But one thing Brady seemed to really have going for him is protection. I hardly ever see him hit unless it's the Super Bowl.
Brady and Manning both are among the best ever at getting the ball out before the rush arrives and taking very few hits. That's part of the reason why they both were able to play so many years with almost no time missed to injuries.

Obviously all QB's need protection just like all RB's need running room so the OL is always key, but I give both those guys a ton of credit for being so smart and decisive with the ball. Unless you can get a rusher free up the middle, then you're almost never going to get them on the ground.
 

jake102

Active Member
I can't believe anyone would choose Manning over Brady. Manning choked in the biggest moments while Brady excelled. Not to mention Manning played the majority of his career with Harrison, Wayne, Clark and the same center for like 15 seasons in a dome.

Both of Manning's Super Bowls came courtesy of the two seasons where his defense was elite (especially the case for the Denver SB where he was terriawful)
 
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