• The KillerFrogs

COVID-19 Threads

brelieve readng this thread is worse to my health than the actual issues caused by the virus for 95+% of those infected whih interestingly is more than the percentage of effective vaccine trials and the accuracy of the gates model, that arsehole from oxford, and brix
I'm having flashbacks to 6th grade where you have to correct misspellings and punctuate. (no offense intended, just had to read it five times, lol)
 

Wexahu

Full Member
Are you suggesting that if the Spanish Flu was 50% as bad, nobody would have noticed? I'm still struggling how you jump from "It wasn't quite as bad as the Spanish flu" (agree), to "We wouldn't have even known it was happening" (definitely disagree).

And you're right that the demos of the Spanish Flu were different on the whole, but to suggest that we just wouldn't have noticed half a million excess deaths in 12 months? Not sure how you can say that. Even if you exclude every COVID death over 65, you're still left with 250,000 deaths. We wouldn't notice that? Take it a step further and look at only under 50, and you're still looking at a death toll bigger than any flu season (across all ages) since at least 1990. I think it's a stretch to say that wouldn't have been noticed in any time period.
Yes, that is what I'm suggesting. But you'd have to also assume the Spanish Flu was impacting elderly people, and not primarily young adults like it was.

Had what happened in March 2020 had instead happened in March 1920 I don't think we would have noticed it. I mean, sure, we keep track of everything and there is news that sensationalizes everything and so on and so forth, but just from a going about your life standpoint, I don't think anyone would have noticed a dang thing.

There have been about 500,000 deaths in this country in people under the age of 75 over the past 2.5 years, so let's just say 250,000 per year as I know there have been peaks and valleys to the death count. 250,000 is about 1 in 1,200 people in that age group per year that was dying. That's just not very many, considering about 11 out of 1,200 people die each year. Take whatever odds you have of dying in any particular year and increase it by 10%, and that's about what happened to your odds during the past couple years. It's just not something from a statistical standpoint that even registers.
 

Zubaz

Member
Yes, that is what I'm suggesting. But you'd have to also assume the Spanish Flu was impacting elderly people, and not primarily young adults like it was.

Had what happened in March 2020 had instead happened in March 1920 I don't think we would have noticed it. I mean, sure, we keep track of everything and there is news that sensationalizes everything and so on and so forth, but just from a going about your life standpoint, I don't think anyone would have noticed a dang thing.

There have been about 500,000 deaths in this country in people under the age of 75 over the past 2.5 years, so let's just say 250,000 per year as I know there have been peaks and valleys to the death count. 250,000 is about 1 in 1,200 people in that age group per year that was dying. That's just not very many, considering about 11 out of 1,200 people die each year. Take whatever odds you have of dying in any particular year and increase it by 10%, and that's about what happened to your odds during the past couple years. It's just not something from a statistical standpoint that even registers.
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We would have noticed this in 1920 dude.
 

Zubaz

Member
Dude, I don't think we would have.

I know we wouldn't have acted like complete idiots about it, chief.
Simultaniously arguing that we would have been completely oblivious to a sudden 40% spike in excess deaths, but also that we wouldn't have been "complete idiots" seems a bit oxymoronic, personally. But we know where each other stands on this.
 

Wexahu

Full Member
Simultaniously arguing that we would have been completely oblivious to a sudden 40% spike in excess deaths, but also that we wouldn't have been "complete idiots" seems a bit oxymoronic, personally. But we know where each other stands on this.
How would we know about a sudden 40% spike in excess deaths (for a very short period of time btw) if there were no TV, no twitter, no CDC keeping track of every single statistic.

And it keeps being ignored, but there is a HUGE difference in Spanish Flu mostly affecting 20-40 year olds at a 2X rate than COVID affecting mostly 75 year-olds. Raw numbers without context don't tell the story. And a 40% spike in a very small number is still a very small number.
 

Zubaz

Member
How would we know about a sudden 40% spike in excess deaths (for a very short period of time btw) if there were no TV, no twitter, no CDC keeping track of every single statistic.
I don't think "a year" is a very short period of time, personally. I believe annual excess mortality in the US for 2020 settled somewhere around 20-30%. For 2021, it was lower, but still in the high teens as I recall. That is absolutely not a small jump, nor was it short term.

We didn't have TV or the internet, but we did used to have Newspapers with near universal circulation, as well as Radio. Word would have gotten out same as it did for the pandemic that did occur in the teens.
And a 40% spike in a very small number is still a very small number.
A spike in mortality of that size is not a very small number.
 

Wexahu

Full Member
I don't think "a year" is a very short period of time, personally. I believe annual excess mortality in the US for 2020 settled somewhere around 20-30%. For 2021, it was lower, but still in the high teens as I recall. That is absolutely not a small jump, nor was it short term.

We didn't have TV or the internet, but we did used to have Newspapers with near universal circulation, as well as Radio. Word would have gotten out same as it did for the pandemic that did occur in the teens.

A spike in mortality of that size is not a very small number.
385,000 COVID deaths reported for 2020. And about the same for 2021. About 2,900,000 people are expected to die each year, so that's about 13% higher, not 20-30%.

To the extent excess mortality was higher than that, it was mostly because of the idiotic things we were doing.

13% is absolutely a small number. I think I saw where it basically takes us back to the mortality rate we had in the mid-90's. I don't remember that a time of widespread death and anguish, do you? And it's temporary anyway. Absolutely not something to jack up the country like we have over.

And I'll say it again because it almost never gets mentioned but it's a critical piece in all this. The MEDIAN age of a COVID victim is over 75 years old, barely below average life expectancy.
 

Frog79

Active Member
Not totally following you. What do you consider a lie? The data is strong that vaccine prevents severe disease.
No, it doesn’t. Show us the data if you think it’s there. I’d love to see it. It probably did help some pre-omicron, but not enough to make up for all the deaths caused by the vaccine. In other words, there has never been any proof that these “vaccines“ lower all cause mortality, either pre-or post omicron. But there is very good evidence that the “vaccines” have increased overall mortality by at least 10 or 15% which is a massive number. Which means that the “vaccines” have been an unmitigated disaster for public health. I don’t know how you can defend this.
 

Frog79

Active Member
385,000 COVID deaths reported for 2020. And about the same for 2021. About 2,900,000 people are expected to die each year, so that's about 13% higher, not 20-30%.

To the extent excess mortality was higher than that, it was mostly because of the idiotic things we were doing.

13% is absolutely a small number. I think I saw where it basically takes us back to the mortality rate we had in the mid-90's. I don't remember that a time of widespread death and anguish, do you? And it's temporary anyway. Absolutely not something to jack up the country like we have over.

And I'll say it again because it almost never gets mentioned but it's a critical piece in all this. The MEDIAN age of a COVID victim is over 75 years old, barely below average life expectancy.
The Covid death numbers put up by the government are bogus. Especially when you consider that proper early treatment with ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, monoclonal, antibodies, etc. would’ve cut the mortality rate probably by 80 or 90%. This was a manufactured pandemic that didn’t have to be.
 
Wait, what? I missed this part of your comment. Since Omicron, how does me getting vaccinated help you?
I can see your point that that seems like an inconsistency. I think now that we are in the endemic phase, it is akin as to why I think it is important for everyone to get the flu vaccine. More immunity out there at a minimum means less severe cases and less time off which means less of an impact of flu/Covid season on healthcare and our community. We have this awesome immune system that we can prime and that helps everyone directly or indirectly as part of a strategy to mitigate the impact of the respiratory infection season. But I do think post omicron there is not a good argument for doing anything more than encouraging the vaccine, especially given the distrust and skepticism out there.
 

froginmn

Full Member
I can see your point that that seems like an inconsistency. I think now that we are in the endemic phase, it is akin as to why I think it is important for everyone to get the flu vaccine. More immunity out there at a minimum means less severe cases and less time off which means less of an impact of flu/Covid season on healthcare and our community. We have this awesome immune system that we can prime and that helps everyone directly or indirectly as part of a strategy to mitigate the impact of the respiratory infection season. But I do think post omicron there is not a good argument for doing anything more than encouraging the vaccine, especially given the distrust and skepticism out there.
Maybe I misunderstood your phrasing. You're saying there isn't much argument in favor of my vaccination protecting others?
 
Maybe I misunderstood your phrasing. You're saying there isn't much argument in favor of my vaccination protecting others?
I guess I’m making the distinction of the role of the vaccine in the pre-omicron phase, when the majority of people had 0 immunity and now when nearly everyone has some. In the pre-omicron phase I think the “protect others” was huge since so many immune naive people were out there. Now it is more about mitigating the morbidity of the season akin to how we use the flu vaccine.
 
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