FWST: LaDainian Tomlinson challenges TCU to examine its past, ties to racial injustice

[Eight]

It was UT. My bad.
TCU does profit from it's fb program.
I'm sure you could provide those numbers.

i am confused on a view things you keep coming back to and they center around things that you mention that no one is denying

please point out the poster or the reply in which the history of this country (let alone any country) is perfectly rosy, that all indigenous people were treated fairly, that the economic development of this country wasn't built on the back of the poor, imigrant, and slave labor, or stated the slavery was a good thing

it is almost as if we are either all in or against which i am a bit confused just as i am about why the athletic department making or losing money is relevant to recognizing the history of the school

 

[Eight]

I agree it's not taught correctly. Problem is that it's literally impossible to teach the entirety of American history in 2 semesters the way it's done in schools. You could spend an entire semester only studying the Civil War and not be able to come close to covering it in a truly comprehensive fashion. It also doesn't help that a lot of Junior High and High School history teachers are actually football and basketball coaches who spend class time watching film while their class watches a History Channel production on Benedict Arnold.

While I understand where you're coming from, it's just not realistic to expect every person to have a full and comprehensive understanding of human history any more than they have a full and comprehensive understanding of quantum physics.

Hell I can't even get people to understand how delicious pumpkin pancakes are.

two strong paragraphs that you [ Finebaum ] all over with your closing statement

 

[flyfishingfrog]

Keep that in mind when your buddies continue to prop up Trump.

Actually most of my “buddies” think he is a moron - but then I don’t hang around with head bobbing sycophants on either side

I chose to associate with people who focus their efforts on analyzing the situation for themselves and realizing both sides are trying to pull the same [ deposit from a bull that looks like Art Briles ] with different stories

 

[Salfrog]

Not really.
My point is true US history is not truthfully taught.
If you care to know, then yes I'm still learning about my ancestors' American history through research.
It's not taught correctly in schools.

I can see this point and agree with it. The question that comes from this is, how do you teach it correctly with the teaching environment that exist now for teachers to teach only what's on the state mandatory test? How do you have teachers teach this class without adding their own personal biases or views?

 

[flyfishingfrog]

I think LT is right - we should know more about our history and be more conversant about it. I'd like to learn more and I have several questions that some of you might know the answers to.

From a TCU360 article, I learned that the first undergraduate African-American students at TCU enrolled in September 1962, including Allene Jones, who was already a licensed nurse but wanted to get a better education to advance in the field. She was one of the first 2 black graduates in May 1963 (along with Doris Anne McBride Goree); she then went to UCLA for an advanced degree and returned in 1968, when she became the first African-American professor, specializing in psychiatric nursing. She taught for nearly 30 years; retiring in 1998. She remained an emeritus professor until she died in 2015. Does anyone remember Professor Jones? Who were some other African-American professors? When did they arrive?

By the time I arrived in the late 70's, the situation had changed substantially - there were many African American students and several Professors. Who were the Board Members and administrators who led this policy?

Who was the first graduate-level African or African-American? I believe that several private Texas schools started recruiting and accepting students in the late 50's from African (and other) countries - did TCU do that? Who were they?

In sports, SMU led the way in 1967 in the SWC with Jerry LeVias - didn't we follow in 1968? Who were the first players? Which sports?

Was the failure to admit black students until then ever a stated formal policy? How did this compare to similarly situated schools?

What is the current percentage of African American students? Graduate and undergraduate? Professors?

So it’s great you feel like learning all of that would be beneficial - for you

but our school knows all of that already and so do people who have cared before this point - so while you as an individual would gain from that retrospective effort - the overall community would not because it’s known data already acted upon to course correct and will not change anything about where we are going because it’s all in the past

spend the time and effort focusing how how to get where we want to be - not forcing those that are aware of the past to explain to those that don’t so they feel better

you should do you own research to further the education you feel valuable- not expect others to do the work for you

 

[flyfishingfrog]

Not really.
My point is true US history is not truthfully taught.
If you care to know, then yes I'm still learning about my ancestors' American history through research.
It's not taught correctly in schools.

And whoever you are learning it from has slanted it also so the quicker you realize that when you hear all sides - the truth is somewhere in the middle the faster you will learn something valuable

my wife’s PHD is in American History before 1804 and she will tell you that the written history of 7 countries with claims to the US in that time frame and 50 tribes are all right and wrong and all different at the same time

 

[CountryFrog]

two strong paragraphs that you [ #2020 ] all over with your closing statement

I'm just more food woke than you

 

[Spike]

And UT is welcome for profiting $114 million from the football program in 2019.
TCU is turning a profit too.

If your employer does not turn a profit they will not be your employer much longer. He was offered a free education and a chance to play. I doubt anyone knew he would be that good.

Doubt TCU turned a profit in the WAC days.

 

[CountryFrog]

Speaking of how little people know about history and how poorly it's taught - Just last week I over heard a conversation between a teenage boy and who I presume to have been his parents. He asked his parents if Andrew Jackson and Stonewall Jackson were the same person. The parents both said yes. So the teenage boy proceeded to tell his parents that he just learned how Andrew Jackson died during the Civil War.

I wanted so badly to speak up and correct them but considered it to probably be a useless endeavor anyway as God only knows what else this family thinks they know about American history. I didn't have time to cover it all for them.

 

[Pharm Frog]

Greater than a 99% chance that everyone who reads this is descended from both slave and slave owner. There...consider it acknowledged.

 

[Hoosierfrog]

Yeah, let's be practical on all of this.......it's already been confirmed, they did not own slaves. Do we erase the history of the US? To my knowledge, we would be the first country in the world to erase our entire history. The former great powers, Egypt, Persia, Rome, GB, didn't do it, but we should?

Not to mention current Africa where slavery still exists.

 

[LSU Game Attendee]

well all this land we live on today was taken by force from the Native Americans - so as my wife would like to say, the rest of you can pack up your crap today and get out.

And those Native Americans dominating the future U.S. in the 17th-19th Centuries had generally put themselves in that position by defeating different populations of Native Americans.

Seinfeld's truism on people is timeless and transcends race.

 

[Eight]

I'm just more food woke than you

was that woke or choke as in you will choke down whatever is set in front of you or both

 

[CountryFrog]

was that woke or choke as in you will choke down whatever is set in front of you or both

Both

 

[Hoosierfrog]

And those Native Americans dominating the future U.S. in the 17th-19th Centuries had generally put themselves in that position by defeating different populations of Native Americans.

Seinfeld's truism on people is timeless and transcends race.

And the Native Americans came across from Asia on the ice bridge across the Bering Straits and probably ran someone else out.

 

[flyfishingfrog]

And the Native Americans came across from Asia on the ice bridge across the Bering Straits and probably ran someone else out.

Who would that someone else have been?

 

[Pharm Frog]

Who would that someone else have been?

slave owners

 

[AroundWorldFrog]

Hell I can't even get people to understand how delicious pumpkin pancakes are.

Com'n man, there's an entire thread on it.

 

[BrewingFrog]

Tons of intellectual thinking and it all has little to do with true US history.
I dare you take a no nonsense look at US history in its rawest form.
It's not as pretty as many pretend it to be.
I do realize that this forum is full of ultra conservative individuals.
Thing is your opinion doesn't outweigh truth.
Debating the 1619 Project on here would be like asking you to think outside what you've been taught since...before slavery in the US.
Why would I believe it would be received objectively?
The only reason it's been brought up is because there are individuals prepared with rebuttals.
Alternative reality would be the correct term.

And you have all the answers. Gosh!

You have no clue as to who I am, or the degree of study I have put into history in the last 50 years or so. It is a passion, not an occupation. I could have had a degree in History had I chose to, but I was fully aware that a professional career in that field was unlikely to be terribly financially rewarding. Thus, the classes I took in that discipline were mainly for fun and casual knowledge, and I consider some of them to be the best hours spent at TCU. The years after that were spent in a line of work that allowed a lot of travel, and thus the opportunity to visit many places and see many things that were important. To breathe the air and tramp the field of Bosworth, to handle a silver Boar pin that was worn by one of Richard's Knights. To walk the ruins of Tintagel, Glastonbury, Kenilworth. To see the site of ancient oppidums destroyed by Caesar. To walk the battlements of Danube castles ranging back to the Celts. To walk the icefields in the Tyrol where Otzi was found along the ancient trade routes across the Alps. To visit Crete and see the Palace of the ancient Minoans. To see what remains of that civilization on Santorini and their ancient paintings. To visit where Alexander the Great destroyed the Phoenician city of Sidon. To walk the streets of Rome. To see what remains of the mighty Aztec temples in Mexico. To see the city left by their predecessors in Teotihuacan. To see the cities of the Maya in Yucatan, Quintana Roo, Guatemala and Belize. Plying the waters of the Eastern Caribbean where Admiral Rodney defeated Comte De Grasse in the Battle of the Saints. To see the monument in Leipzig of the Battle of the Nations where Napoleon was finally decisively defeated. To see the many, many historical places and battlefields too numerous to count here in America. And, most importantly, the knowledge gained by reading many source materiels to understand the importance of these places and things, and their place in the vast tapestry of history.

So, I guess I don't know anything. Just my opinions...

 

[2themax]

And you have all the answers. Gosh!

You have no clue as to who I am, or the degree of study I have put into history in the last 50 years or so. It is a passion, not an occupation. I could have had a degree in History had I chose to, but I was fully aware that a professional career in that field was unlikely to be terribly financially rewarding. Thus, the classes I took in that discipline were mainly for fun and casual knowledge, and I consider some of them to be the best hours spent at TCU. The years after that were spent in a line of work that allowed a lot of travel, and thus the opportunity to visit many places and see many things that were important. To breathe the air and tramp the field of Bosworth, to handle a silver Boar pin that was worn by one of Richard's Knights. To walk the ruins of Tintagel, Glastonbury, Kenilworth. To see the site of ancient oppidums destroyed by Caesar. To walk the battlements of Danube castles ranging back to the Celts. To walk the icefields in the Tyrol where Otzi was found along the ancient trade routes across the Alps. To visit Crete and see the Palace of the ancient Minoans. To see what remains of that civilization on Santorini and their ancient paintings. To visit where Alexander the Great destroyed the Phoenician city of Sidon. To walk the streets of Rome. To see what remains of the mighty Aztec temples in Mexico. To see the city left by their predecessors in Teotihuacan. To see the cities of the Maya in Yucatan, Quintana Roo, Guatemala and Belize. Plying the waters of the Eastern Caribbean where Admiral Rodney defeated Comte De Grasse in the Battle of the Saints. To see the monument in Leipzig of the Battle of the Nations where Napoleon was finally decisively defeated. To see the many, many historical places and battlefields to numerous to count here in America. And, most importantly, the knowledge gained by reading many source materiels to understand the importance of these places and things, and their place in the vast tapestry of history.

So, I guess I don't know anything. Just my opinions...

I appreciate your illustrious exploits and accomplishments, but what does that have to do with the subject at hand?
The topic is realistic US history being taught in the US.