• The KillerFrogs

Offensive line was not good

TopFrog

Lifelong Frog
Besides the defense being gashed off-tackle for several huge running plays one of my biggest takeaways is that we couldn't block and stop a three-man rush on passing plays. (Plus some disastrous snaps).

On the offensive line:
"To be honest, we have to better against a three-man rush. We are going up against a four-man rush next week. You have to give Iowa State some credit, they have some pretty good players. We have a week to prepare though and there is a lot to do between now and then for us to get these guys better."
 
The OL inadequacy seems to be emblematic of the dearth of performance displayed

throughout the entire offense and defense. The degree of preparation administered

by the coaching staff should also be called into question.
 

BrewingFrog

Was I supposed to type something here?
The worst thing is, the game plan (such as it was) was not geared towards the strengths of the line. We did decently in run blocking, were better in regular formations suited to RPO, and terrible in 5-wide. Downing held on to the ball too long on a couple of sacks, but the 5-wide meant that a DE was getting a wave of the red cape and charging into an unprotected QB.

Wasn't this apparent in practice? If so, why in hell would you incorporate it into a game plan? If, as I always lament, we have a Staff who will hammer a square peg into a round hole no matter how bad the fit, then we had better get used to craptacular outcomes like this last one. Coaches should be putting players in positions and situations in which they can succeed. Even excel. Evidently, our Staff is unable to follow this simple philosophy, instead insisting on putting players in positions where they are likely to fail, and let down their teammates.

In contrast, I enjoyed watching the UT match yesterday. Their O-line is playing as a tight unit, working together with confidence and even pride. One play in particular: Down near the Tech goal line, running play D&D, cadence draws the NG over the line. The UT center, without breaking stance, reaches out and taps the Tech NG on the helmet while he's over the line. Ding! Easy 5 yards. They have gotten the hard things worked out and are working on a lot of the smaller and smarter things.

We cannot get out of our own way.
 
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JugbandFrog

Full Member
Problem: offensive line play was awful and it’s because of poor coaching.

solution: hire a real OL coach that has had success
I don’t know if a REAL OL coach would cone here. We got Thomsen, but he was on the outs over at Arizona State(?).

But part of it goes back to scheme and playing to your strengths. We aren’t Navy where we HAVE to run the Option because of a consistently undersized OL. We have the size and strength to compete, but it’s an OC that is hell-bent on doing it a certain way that just doesn’t work. Outside of having Boykin/Doctson and some fortunate scenarios, the O has not been consistent. They don’t get beat so much as they beat themselves.

A real OL coach won’t come to this current configuration of OCs. The system is far too all over the place, and it pushes rather than supports an OL. Which makes them look worse than they really are. Now don’t get me wrong, what we saw yesterday was bad. Really bad. Poor coaching bad.

An OL coach likes to have some input, kinda like Scotty from Star Trek. Even if they get ignored anyway.
 

HFrog12

Full Member
Wasn't this apparent in practice? If so, why in hell would you incorporate it into a game plan?

We cannot get out of our own way.

To be fair our coaches probably saw our OTs holding their own against our DEs and figured hey they can hold up. Without taking into account how bad our DEs are. So it probably wasn’t that apparent in practice, ha. Just a situation where both groups play down to each other.
 

Surfrog

Active Member
I don’t know if a REAL OL coach would cone here. We got Thomsen, but he was on the outs over at Arizona State(?).

But part of it goes back to scheme and playing to your strengths. We aren’t Navy where we HAVE to run the Option because of a consistently undersized OL. We have the size and strength to compete, but it’s an OC that is hell-bent on doing it a certain way that just doesn’t work. Outside of having Boykin/Doctson and some fortunate scenarios, the O has not been consistent. They don’t get beat so much as they beat themselves.

A real OL coach won’t come to this current configuration of OCs. The system is far too all over the place, and it pushes rather than supports an OL. Which makes them look worse than they really are. Now don’t get me wrong, what we saw yesterday was bad. Really bad. Poor coaching bad.

An OL coach likes to have some input, kinda like Scotty from Star Trek. Even if they get ignored anyway.


It's not Cumbie/Meacham/Scheme. If anything, they are having to scheme for an OL that is terrible (hence the lateral running plays). If you bring a TE or FB in, you'll also bring in another linebacker or safety in the box, therefore loading the box and giving more work for the OL.

Fact is Anderson is a terrible OL coach. He last worked with OL from 98-00 as a GA.
 

tcuball3

Ticket Exchange Pass
It's not Cumbie/Meacham/Scheme. If anything, they are having to scheme for an OL that is terrible (hence the lateral running plays). If you bring a TE or FB in, you'll also bring in another linebacker or safety in the box, therefore loading the box and giving more work for the OL.

Fact is Anderson is a terrible OL coach. He last worked with OL from 98-00 as a GA.
I’d like to know who else was interviewed for the position. ADJD certainly requires multiple candidates be interviewed for open jobs right? Or is nepotism totally acceptable at TCU?
 

JugbandFrog

Full Member
It's not Cumbie/Meacham/Scheme. If anything, they are having to scheme for an OL that is terrible (hence the lateral running plays). If you bring a TE or FB in, you'll also bring in another linebacker or safety in the box, therefore loading the box and giving more work for the OL.

Fact is Anderson is a terrible OL coach. He last worked with OL from 98-00 as a GA.
We have been complaining about or OL for a while. It is the scheme. You can protect and play to strengths of an OL with the right play calling and understanding what is happening on your OL. The C was getting killed early, so the guards supported him, which left a gap on a 4-5 wide set inside of the T. What does the end do? He starts using an inside move because there is no traffic there to slow him down. But then, the DE also just started darting straight up field and using speed to get around the T. The T, with their poor technique, and being left on an island were screwed. What do the OCs do, they roll the dice, and hope nothing happens. Well, something happened, and the OL couldn't handle three rushers and the Cyclones dropped 8 into coverage.

The Frogs don't seem to like quick passes or any kind of drags over the middle, so again, no support for an OL. Draw plays, quick passes, shifting the pocket with rollouts, etc.. these kinds of things can help a struggling OL. The shovel pass was actually a good call against an attacking DL, and I would have liked to seen more of it.

Remember, ISU runs a 3-3-5 scheme. In schemes like this, TEs are golden. You see what TEs do to our 4-2-5. I predict we will do better against UT because they run a 4 man front, so there is less space, and more men in front of our OL, but it won't be consistent. The Cs we ran out there were not good against a NT.

The best I have ever seen a draw/shovel system used was when Florida used it to beat Bama in 92. Bama was TOO good up front for Florida to attack conventionally. they HAD to slow down that rush, and put them on their toes mentally.

 

Surfrog

Active Member
We have been complaining about or OL for a while. It is the scheme. You can protect and play to strengths of an OL with the right play calling and understanding what is happening on your OL. The C was getting killed early, so the guards supported him, which left a gap on a 4-5 wide set inside of the T. What does the end do? He starts using an inside move because there is no traffic there to slow him down. But then, the DE also just started darting straight up field and using speed to get around the T. The T, with their poor technique, and being left on an island were screwed. What do the OCs do, they roll the dice, and hope nothing happens. Well, something happened, and the OL couldn't handle three rushers and the Cyclones dropped 8 into coverage.

The Frogs don't seem to like quick passes or any kind of drags over the middle, so again, no support for an OL. Draw plays, quick passes, shifting the pocket with rollouts, etc.. these kinds of things can help a struggling OL. The shovel pass was actually a good call against an attacking DL, and I would have liked to seen more of it.

Remember, ISU runs a 3-3-5 scheme. In schemes like this, TEs are golden. You see what TEs do to our 4-2-5. I predict we will do better against UT because they run a 4 man front, so there is less space, and more men in front of our OL, but it won't be consistent. The Cs we ran out there were not good against a NT.

The best I have ever seen a draw/shovel system used was when Florida used it to beat Bama in 92. Bama was TOO good up front for Florida to attack conventionally. they HAD to slow down that rush, and put them on their toes mentally.



We've been complaining about it since the GA who came with Meacham (I forget his name) left, his GA year was Andersons first year as an OL Coach. It's been downhill ever sense. Also, good point about 3-3-5 as that defense seems to be our weakness. As for quick passes, we do run a lot of Mesh routes, but the QB often throws the deep post in 1-1 coverage as the linebackers swallow the drag. Likewise, 5 yard outs are a staple of the air raid. When rushing 3, draws don't work.
 

ticketfrog123

Active Member
I’d like to know who else was interviewed for the position. ADJD certainly requires multiple candidates be interviewed for open jobs right? Or is nepotism totally acceptable at TCU?

EEOC laws basically require multiple interviews and the job being posted for X days

which is why you see head coaching job postings being picked up by blogs and some interesting applications from fans.
 

Eight

Member
EEOC laws basically require multiple interviews and the job being posted for X days

which is why you see head coaching job postings being picked up by blogs and some interesting applications from fans.

was the position ever open or was this a situation where answered was moved into the position and the two new coaching positions that were posted was a receiver coach position and a running back coach position?
 

Eight

Member
So basically they went around the EEOC laws? At any rate it wasn’t an open and fair process, nor did it bring in a suitable candidate with a fresh perspective.

far, far less interested if tcu complied with eeoc hiring guidelines or if the process was fair, but am interested if they ever considered looking for an outside candidate or if it was falling back into what sonny and gary were comfortable
 

ticketfrog123

Active Member
So basically they went around the EEOC laws? At any rate it wasn’t an open and fair process, nor did it bring in a suitable candidate with a fresh perspective.

unlikely. Every position doesn’t have to be posted, but most are.

there’s some criteria to exclude them from public posting.

ie. The CEO role for a publicly traded company isn’t listed on the careers page.
 

Eight

Member
One of the I state D linemen set the record for all time sacks during the game so keep that and the inexperience in mind. That being said they still need to improve greatly as the season progresses which I expect them to do.

what inexperience?

that was a fifth year senior who has played a great deal that was getting worn out
 
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