FWST: TCU’s Patterson is ‘not OK’ with growing pains of young QB. So how will the Frogs adjust?

[CountryFrog]

In most posts I see from you it is implied that the offense hasn't been too bad, that they've played well enough that if the defense held up its end of the bargain we'd be winning these games.

The offense is just as much a reason we are losing as the defense. You can't be completely ineffective in first halves of games and expect to win games.

That was my opinion of the SMU game. Not sure where you're getting that I feel that way about this last game unless you hist think that my opinions of one game carry over every week of the season for every game.

Still, as bad as it was, this was the best offensive performance we've had against Iowa St in the last 3 years. It wasn't a good performance but it also shouldn't have resulted in a 25 point loss. No way was there any scenario where I would predict that ISU could score 49 on any team in this conference other than Kansas, regardless of turnovers or anything else that happened.

 

[netty2424]

FWIW (ESPN)stat comparison between Kenny Hill in Ames(2017) and Max Duggan in Ames(2019)

And before anyone blows up on KH, this is about MD, not KH. Just thinking back at how KH struggled badly in that game and was curious how the numbers stacked up.

Different years, defenses, players, etc. just an interesting look back/comparison.

KH
2017: L 14-7
12/25, 135 yards; 48% completion
2 Interceptions
QBR: 6.1
Passer rating: 77.4
12 rush attempts for 43 yards

MD
2019: L 49-24
17/25, 219 yards; 68% completion
0 interceptions
QBR: 51.9
Passer rating: 168
10 rushing attempts for 34 yards

 

[LVH]

On defense, TCU is the most athletic they have ever been. They still have to execute. Which the lack of execution seems to be the problem. They got to make plays.

Sometimes coaches can get caught up in athletic ability and not making sure the kid makes plays in HS. Got to have FB instinct first. If one doesn’t, then one ends up with adage; “Look like Tarzan, hit like Jane.”

Do you see our defensive end groups from our Mountain West teams ever being blown 5 yards off the ball every play by TIGHT ENDS? I sure don't. Yes our current DEs may be more talented on paper but for some reason they are getting dominated at the line of scrimmage not by offensive lineman, but tight ends.

 

[Wexahu]

That was my opinion of the SMU game. Not sure where you're getting that I feel that way about this last game unless you hist think that my opinions of one game carry over every week of the season for every game.

Still, as bad as it was, this was the best offensive performance we've had against Iowa St in the last 3 years. It wasn't a good performance but it also shouldn't have resulted in a 25 point loss. No way was there any scenario where I would predict that ISU could score 49 on any team in this conference other than Kansas, regardless of turnovers or anything else that happened.

It was 42 points. Iowa State averaged 30 ppg against Big 12 opponents last year, it's not like 42 points is such a huge outlier. They scored 46 against OSU last year.

 

[CountryFrog]

FWIW (ESPN)stat comparison between Kenny Hill in Ames(2017) and Max Duggan in Ames(2019)

And before anyone blows up on KH, this is about MD, not KH. Just thinking back at how KH struggled badly in that game and was curious how the numbers stacked up.

Different years, defenses, players, etc. just an interesting look back/comparison.

KH
2017: L 14-7
12/25, 135 yards; 48% completion
2 Interceptions
QBR: 6.1
Passer rating: 77.4
12 rush attempts for 43 yards

MD
2019: L 49-24
17/25, 219 yards; 68% completion
0 interceptions
QBR: 51.9
Passer rating: 168
10 rushing attempts for 34 yards

5th year senior compared to a true freshman. Max has been up and down all year but overall has been pretty dang good for a true freshman. It's not his fault that we're in such a bad place at that position that we have to rely on a true freshman.

 

[MinFrog]

The problem is not being able to run the ball on a 5 man front. It happened just about every play last Saturday. It is a miracle that a true freshman QB can put up the numbers he did while not throwing a pic considering how awful our run game was.

Also, the defense is a below average defense in the Big XII - maybe that should get some of GP's attention as well.

 

[Wexahu]

FWIW (ESPN)stat comparison between Kenny Hill in Ames(2017) and Max Duggan in Ames(2019)

And before anyone blows up on KH, this is about MD, not KH. Just thinking back at how KH struggled badly in that game and was curious how the numbers stacked up.

Different years, defenses, players, etc. just an interesting look back/comparison.

KH
2017: L 14-7
12/25, 135 yards; 48% completion
2 Interceptions
QBR: 6.1
Passer rating: 77.4
12 rush attempts for 43 yards

MD
2019: L 49-24
17/25, 219 yards; 68% completion
0 interceptions
QBR: 51.9
Passer rating: 168
10 rushing attempts for 34 yards

Fair enough, but I tend to discount stats somewhat after you fall behind by more than a couple scores. The Cowboys raked up over 560 yards of offense yesterday. Do you think the offense had a good game?

When the game was in the balance and it really mattered they couldn't get it done. That's the important thing.

 

[CountryFrog]

It was 42 points. Iowa State averaged 30 ppg against Big 12 opponents last year, it's not like 42 points is such a huge outlier. They scored 46 against OSU last year.

Great, our defense is comparable with Ok State now. Solid point and very reassuring for us all.

 

[Eight]

The problem is not being able to run the ball on a 5 man front. It happened just about every play last Saturday. It is a miracle that a true freshman QB can put up the numbers he did while not throwing a pic considering how awful our run game was.

Also, the defense is a below average defense in the Big XII - maybe that should get some of GP's attention as well.

actually, sonny abandoned the run game after the drive that resulted in the field goal until the final drive of the half when they brought in delton.

iowa state was sitting on the zone read and would use run blitzes to create losses, but the chance was there if sonny had stuck with it.

for some reason he went away from the run game and put everything on the shoulders of max without helping max in the routes called

 

[CountryFrog]

actually, sonny abandoned the run game after the drive that resulted in the field goal until the final drive of the half when they brought in delton.

iowa state was sitting on the zone read and would use run blitzes to create losses, but the chance was there if sonny had stuck with it.

for some reason he went away from the run game and put everything on the shoulders of max without helping max in the routes called

The fumble Max had was a great (or terrible for us) example of this. You're asking a heck of a lot out of your true freshman backed up on that part of the field against a defense that's playing very aggressive to go play action without any short routes or checkdowns. I'm sure Sonny's thinking was to try and get someone into a seam against that coverage that ISU likes to play but it's a huge risk on that part of the field with no outlet.

 

[puckster59]

Lots of problems obviously. I’m wondering how much accountability and leadership is going on in that locker room. Doesn’t seem like much at all.

 

[netty2424]

5th year senior compared to a true freshman. Max has been up and down all year but overall has been pretty dang good for a true freshman. It's not his fault that we're in such a bad place at that position that we have to rely on a true freshman.

It proves one thing, quarterbackin’ is hard.

 

[Salfrog]

i would not say he wasted a year with KH. Kenny played really solid in his second year of running the offense. And his first year, was after a year and a half of not playing ball.

KH played better in 17 because Dykes was here as offensive analyst and simplified the offense to what Kenny was good at. He still struggled with throws beyond 15 yards, but Dykes put him in better situations to succeed.

 

[asleep003]

Collins … Max to come in to spark, if need be.

 

[cheese83]

Sure feels like Patterson is throwing a true freshman under the bus with this statement. All he has done is what the coaches have asked of him.

 

[Froggish]

GPs defense has sucked...Period

At the same time the game has evolved a battle of offenses..Defenses are facing more plays than ever before in the history of football. Rules continually favor the offensive side of the ball. Expectations must change in regard to what a good defense looks like....AND an offense must be able to take pressure off of defenses. An offense must do it’s part because Offenses don’t get scored on..They have to put up points and possess the ball. Simple really...more bad things can happen with your defense on the field then your offense..

The defense has sucked...Period...But if you give TCU an offense that starts fast (scores early), and protects the ball (limits TOs), I bet we are talking about GPs defense much differently.

 

[tetonfrog]

Sure feels like Patterson is throwing a true freshman under the bus with this statement. All he has done is what the coaches have asked of him.

In the first half, Max has been bad - very bad - in two of the last three games. He is not doing what the coaches want because he turned the ball over several times. Now, he has been good in the second half when the Frogs have to throw, throw and go up tempo.

The question is why can't SC/GP get Max and the offense going int he first half. It is a million dollar ? Sonny has to solve.

 

[Gehörnter Frosch]

Offenses don’t get scored on...QUOTE]
Oh, but ours does.

 

[Froggish]

I’ll amend my statement.. “Sometimes offenses get scored on”...Defenses always get scored on..

 

[cheese83]

In the first half, Max has been bad - very bad - in two of the last three games. He is not doing what the coaches want because he turned the ball over several times. Now, he has been good in the second half when the Frogs have to throw, throw and go up tempo.

The question is why can't SC/GP get Max and the offense going int he first half. It is a million dollar ? Sonny has to solve.

Well yeah all of us fans have noticed that Duggan and the offense as a whole struggles in the first half. The last few years we've always seemed to start slow for some reason.
But do you come out and shatter your QBs confidence like that? What was the point of those soundbites?