netty2424
Full Member
Hi Mr. Collins! How’s your sons foot doing? Sounds like he’s coming along.
Fall camp thread
- Thread starter CryptoMiner
- Start date
Billy Clyde
Active Member
IDK how good our O-line will be. BUT- If they turn out to be very good, AND if our run game is as stout as we think it will be, I will start to feel like wanting to see Justin back there as a pocket passer. He's certainly the closest thing we have to a pro-style passer from a physical standpoint. I've made this point before, but go back and look at how many prolific passers out of the Leach coaching tree were absolute statues in the pocket and managed to put up ridiculous numbers.
jake102
Active Member
Disappointing definitely isn't the right word. I loved the Rose Bowl and Peach Bowl seasons, same with Fiesta Bowl season. 2017 was good as well. But coming into a season, the only thing I care about is a NC until it's out of reach. Once it's out of reach I don't really care what players we play or whether we win or lose because it's marginal the benefit/consequence. Obviously I lose my mind during literally every game, but I can eat the losses without much trouble.
I don't think there's really a difference in recruiting between 9-3 and 7-5.
The idea that Duggan needs to be QB to maximize NC was simply a scenario by 247. I have no idea if it's in any way true.
Zebra Frog
KMA
I don't give a crap who starts. Just win.
jake102
Active Member
I think you and everyone else can go ahead and start giving up on the JR dream. Unless it's a massive smokescreen, unlike any from GP before, he's not going to be TCU's starting QB (probably ever)
LawFrog504
Active Member
Jesus Christ, god help us all if this last sentence is true.
West Coast Johnny
Full Member
I've seen Delton play about four or five times over the years including two below-average-at-best outings versus TCU. He's a good leader but I haven't been impressed with the games I've seen. For this reason, I'm hoping that Duggan is the game one starter but I'm not holding my breath.
Billy Clyde
Active Member
I don't know why that would be. It seems like there would come a point where he (JR) would conclude that it's as good as it's going to get, and adapt his game accordingly. I mean, if his injury were an absolute disqualification from being able to play, then what's he doing still suiting up??? Obviously there's value in being able to run as a qb, but it's sure as heck not a requirement for success. Look at the number of great, not just good, QBs in NFL history, and the ones who were runners are very few and far between. The only caveat to all this is, assuming he reaches a point where he isn't at any great risk of a crippling injury simply by being out there.
Eight
Member
it isn't always about being able to run, but move and do so quickly and in a sideways manner.
even in the case of pocket quarterback they have to be able to move around even if just a short distance and it seems it is those type of movements he is struggling with for what we all know.
you are way off base trying to compare a kid recovering from a significant knee and lower leg injury that has ended careers and tom brady or dan marino's lack of perceived mobility in the pocket.
Eight
Member
i think give up is a bit strong at this point and time, but i do agree that the odds are not very good he sees much action playing quarterback at the start of the year and if i was pressed on would be next spring is a better chance this fall.
justin is just a little over two years removed from a significant knee and lower leg injury that has ended a number of careers.
people are just going to have to be patient and if he could truly compete i have no idea why the sonny wouldn't give him a fair chance unless he just wasn't physically ready to play.
jake102
Active Member
This. Tom Brady certainly can't run, but he can make quick side steps to re-set the pocket when needed. From what's being reported, JR is having trouble with that kind of movement.
BrewingFrog
Was I supposed to type something here?
As to "how well guys do in practice" Coachspeak, there was once this third-string guy who was terrible in practice named Jeff Ballard...
Billy Clyde
Active Member
I wasn't going to bring up Marino specifically, but since you did, I'll remind you that his FIRST major knee surgery was as a rookie, and he played the majority of his career with braces on BOTH knees. He was generally regarded as having the worst knees by far in pro football during his career, maybe in history- not to mention the torn achilles he suffered in '93. He was an absolute stiff in the pocket, as immobile as they come- in any direction.... While steadily tearing up passing records.
I'm not saying JR is Marino, I'm simply saying that being mobile as a qb is a luxury, not a prerequisite.
That's what we keep hearing from just about anyone who has watched the 2 practices - quick sideways moves to avoid a blitz not there. As for throwing the ball and making decisions, he has not looked very good, hence 4th. string. If he was dropping 40 yd. dimes and you heard the oohs and clapping, he would be 1st. or 2nd. He's only a RSF so he has time..........if he stays.
H0RNEDFR0G
Full Member
We have been on the cusp of greatness in the B12. We just needed to get past OU. If OU didn't get Baker Mayfield, we could have 2 more B12 Championship Trophies in the DMC as we speak (2015 & 2017). As it sits, our sole B12 title came in the year Mayfield was forced to sit out.
After Mayfield, lightning struck again in Kyler Murray. But OU is not going to have the Heisman Trophy winner and number #1 overall pick in the NFL every season. Their luck will run out, most likely this year. I'm not sure it mattered who they trotted out against us last year, 2018 was a disaster.
TCU went 0-5 against Mayfield (I'm including the TTU loss). There's zero shame in that, Baker did that to a lot of teams. Today it feels like OU is unbeatable, but that's because they've beaten us 3 times in 2 years with a MOV > 3 TDs.
But before Mayfield, in 2012, 2013 (when we were really bad), & 2014, we were 1-2 against OU. Our 2 loses came by 3 and 7 points.
In 2015, we lost by 1 point after Baker dropped 2 TDs and Seibert got 3 FG's (all for >35 yards) to get 23 points for OU in the first half. Baker didn't play the 2nd half and Trevor Knight couldn't move the ball on us. TCU outscored them 22-7. Their sole second half TD came from a busted play - a 72 yard TD run by Perine. Foster Sawyer started that game and got a majority of the snaps. BK came in down by 17 with 2 mins left in the 3rd and we were a failed 2 point conversion away from winning.
After Mayfield, lightning struck again in Kyler Murray. But OU is not going to have the Heisman Trophy winner and number #1 overall pick in the NFL every season. Their luck will run out, most likely this year. I'm not sure it mattered who they trotted out against us last year, 2018 was a disaster.
TCU went 0-5 against Mayfield (I'm including the TTU loss). There's zero shame in that, Baker did that to a lot of teams. Today it feels like OU is unbeatable, but that's because they've beaten us 3 times in 2 years with a MOV > 3 TDs.
But before Mayfield, in 2012, 2013 (when we were really bad), & 2014, we were 1-2 against OU. Our 2 loses came by 3 and 7 points.
In 2015, we lost by 1 point after Baker dropped 2 TDs and Seibert got 3 FG's (all for >35 yards) to get 23 points for OU in the first half. Baker didn't play the 2nd half and Trevor Knight couldn't move the ball on us. TCU outscored them 22-7. Their sole second half TD came from a busted play - a 72 yard TD run by Perine. Foster Sawyer started that game and got a majority of the snaps. BK came in down by 17 with 2 mins left in the 3rd and we were a failed 2 point conversion away from winning.
Froggish
Active Member
The makings of a great QB include
Arm strength
Accuracy
Decision Making/Smarts
Competitiveness
Quick feet..
Arm strength and Feet are dead last to me in importance. I’ll take a smart, accurate guy over just about anyone. The others are nice but I can’t win without Smarts and accuracy
Arm strength
Accuracy
Decision Making/Smarts
Competitiveness
Quick feet..
Arm strength and Feet are dead last to me in importance. I’ll take a smart, accurate guy over just about anyone. The others are nice but I can’t win without Smarts and accuracy
Eight
Member
dan marino played 20 years ago and survived at the end of his career of his 15+ years of experience reading defenses and even with that you saw a drop in his quarterback rating, completion percentage, touchdown throws, and a rise in interceptions.
he also wasn't a stiff at pitt nor when he first entered the nfl.
additionally, defensive football has changed just a bit over the last 20 years and you can not have a quarterback who has no lateral pocket movement let alone a degree of escapability.
there is no viable reason for sonny to not truly allow justin to compete for the position unless he isn't well so all the what if's and historical comparisons aren't nothing but bad bar anecdotes
Amen. Every QB needs a basic level of arm strength but having a cannon is not that important at all. If I'm ranking those traits by level of importance it's Decision Making, Competitiveness, Accuracy, Quick Feet and then Arm Strength.
