Sewo arrested, controlled substance

[McFroggin]

You just presented some strong generalizations. I’ve read over 50% of ppl over the age of 18 have tried marijuana at some point in their life. Of those, an estimated 44% still use it today. Based on your thoughts, we should see a high number of those ppl that have used cocaine or heroin. However, those numbers aren’t even close. Not even in the same ballpark. And further, that’s a large chunk of the US pop using this “incredibly dangerous” substance - wouldn’t we see a lot of people coming forward experiencing psychosis and irreversible brain damage? Does that happen, sure, but a very very low percentage. Instead, I see a ton of ppl that use it to help take the edge off and relax, similarly to ppl getting a drink after work.

Let’s see the data that support these claims. If you sub-specialized adolescent addiction, surely you are familiar with these many large studies that demonstrate marijuana is a gateway drug. I’d love to take a look... for real. I have strep throat currently, so I have some time to read up and educate myself.

You are throwing out random percentages of people that "use" it as something related to addiction?

Johnston LD Monitoring the Future study. 68.2% of US senior have tried alcohol. Are many of them truly addicted? No. Does it mean that it isn't a gateway drug? Absolutely not.

Marijuana today is far more potent than it was in the 1970's. The percent of THC has increased from on average of 1% in the 70's to 9% in 2008. It's likely 10%+ now. The resulting problems have been huge.

Endocannabinoids shape brain development see Galve-Roperh Eur Arch Psychiatry Clin Neuroscience 2009.

THC reduces hippocampal neuron activation causing permanently smaller hippocampi and poorer memory. Changing brain chemistry effects ability to regulate mood, feel pleasure, etc. See Bossong MG Adolescent brain maturation.....in Progress of Neurobiology.

You permanently damage the ability to feel pleasure, so what do you do? You move on to something more potent.

Marijuana use increases the risk of psychosis, anxiety, depression, and schizophrenia by 2-5x. On an individual basis, that doesn't seem big, but across the population, it is incredibly damaging.

Meier et al Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences demonstrated IQ decline that is not recovered. Average decline was 7 points. That is a huge drop.

In 2006, Lynskey published a study showing roughly 16x greater risk of harder drugs after marijuana use. Keep in mind the gateway hypothesis never established a direct progression. Some studies show 1/6th of adolescents will go on to develop dependence in 2-4 years. 2006 Fergusson completed a 25 year longitudinal study showing cannabis is a gateway drug. In 2015, Secades et al Probability and Predictors of the Cannabis Gateway Effect again showed it to be a gateway drug.

As prevalence increases, we are actually seeing marijuana often being used first and transitioning to alcohol and then higher.

With that said, the majority of people who use marijuana, alcohol, nicotine, caffeine, etc. do not go on to use harder substances. That does not make them less of a gateway drug though.

 

[Hoosierfrog]

Much more likely they started with other opioids

I’m just guessing, but it seems unlikely opioids are the first step in junior high or high school...

 

[hiphopfroggy]

I’m just guessing, but it seems unlikely opioids are the first step in junior high or high school...

not when these kids are still living at home, and their parents have cabinets full of legal opioids prescribed by doctors and zero weed. Kind of makes the decision easy.

 

[4 Oaks Frog]

I clicked on the link. Some interesting quotes in there from the actual author and the doctors that treated the child:

Co-author Thomas Nappe stressed in an interview with The Washington Post that the marijuana was associated with the death but was not indicative of a cause-and-effect relationship. “We are absolutely not saying that marijuana killed that child,” Nappe told the Post.

The authors wrote that urine screening for marijuana may be useful if other patients come in with the same symptoms and doctors can’t find a cause.

“In the age of legalized marijuana, children are at increased risk of exposure, mainly through ingestion of food products, or ‘edibles,’” they wrote.

Doctors were skeptical of the connection, pointing out that there were still many other possible risk factors that could have caused the child’s condition. “It’s too much as far as I’m concerned,” Dr. Noah Kaufman, an emergency medicine specialist, told KUSA. “Because that is saying confidently that this is the first case. ‘We’ve got one!’ And I still disagree with that.”

“You just can’t make those statements because then what happens is lay people say, ‘Oh my God, did you hear a kid died from marijuana poisoning?’ and it can be sensationalized,” Noah Kaufman, a Northern Colorado emergency room physician, also told the Post.

Huh.

Here are some fun facts from the CDC:

With the exception of heroin, all of the drugs listed here are prescribed by a person with a medical license. Alcohol is not even included in this chart and you have to assume those numbers are astronomical. Deadly pharmaceuticals are legally sold every day, while natural cannabis is still illegal in most states. Dumb.

Can you get a script for cocaine now?
Hey, any news on Sewo?
GO FROGS!
BEAT EVERYBODY!
Spit Blood ~~<~<and [Baylor asshoe]!!

 

[McFroggin]

Can you get a script for cocaine now?
Hey, any news on Sewo?
GO FROGS!
BEAT EVERYBODY!
Spit Blood ~~<~<and [Baylor asshoe]!!

No, but you can get one for methamphetamine.

 

[Putt4Purple]

Good Lord! The bombastic statements on this thread has gone over the top. Drugs affect different people in different ways. 40 years ago when I was 20 years of age, I tried Marijuana about 5 times. The affect it gave me was for me wanting to crawl in a corner and go to sleep. Since that time I have been more than happy with a beer or two or three. No drugs in my life since then. So senseless to hyperbole about this subject. TCU needs to make a decision about Sewo. Lets move on.

 

[tcudoc]

You are throwing out random percentages of people that "use" it as something related to addiction?

Johnston LD Monitoring the Future study. 68.2% of US senior have tried alcohol. Are many of them truly addicted? No. Does it mean that it isn't a gateway drug? Absolutely not.

Marijuana today is far more potent than it was in the 1970's. The percent of THC has increased from on average of 1% in the 70's to 9% in 2008. It's likely 10%+ now. The resulting problems have been huge.

Endocannabinoids shape brain development see Galve-Roperh Eur Arch Psychiatry Clin Neuroscience 2009.

THC reduces hippocampal neuron activation causing permanently smaller hippocampi and poorer memory. Changing brain chemistry effects ability to regulate mood, feel pleasure, etc. See Bossong MG Adolescent brain maturation.....in Progress of Neurobiology.

You permanently damage the ability to feel pleasure, so what do you do? You move on to something more potent.

Marijuana use increases the risk of psychosis, anxiety, depression, and schizophrenia by 2-5x. On an individual basis, that doesn't seem big, but across the population, it is incredibly damaging.

Meier et al Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences demonstrated IQ decline that is not recovered. Average decline was 7 points. That is a huge drop.

In 2006, Lynskey published a study showing roughly 16x greater risk of harder drugs after marijuana use. Keep in mind the gateway hypothesis never established a direct progression. Some studies show 1/6th of adolescents will go on to develop dependence in 2-4 years. 2006 Fergusson completed a 25 year longitudinal study showing cannabis is a gateway drug. In 2015, Secades et al Probability and Predictors of the Cannabis Gateway Effect again showed it to be a gateway drug.

As prevalence increases, we are actually seeing marijuana often being used first and transitioning to alcohol and then higher.

With that said, the majority of people who use marijuana, alcohol, nicotine, caffeine, etc. do not go on to use harder substances. That does not make them less of a gateway drug though.

This is the same information I read in an editorial this week on the subject. It was written by a respected editor of a pubmed indexed journal.

 

[Pharm Frog]

I am not here to argue, but, to say that all doctors are on board that THC is a harmless drug is not really true. I just read an editorial a couple of days ago on the issue by a well respected physician. He brought up some interesting points.

Twenty five years ago, we were all told that oxycontin was a harmless, less addictive treatment option for chronic pain...

In medicine, I have learned that everything goes in cycles. The old thoughts get recycled and what was once standard of care can become malpractice, only to become standard of care again 20 years later. There is more we don't know than there is that we do know.

I don't really care too much about THC and the legalization issue, but I do think that as it becomes more pervasive in our culture, we will all get to see what the downsides are, and I feel certain that they will be worse than some on here currently believe. If the benefits of decriminalizing it are greater than the downsides, well that is that. Alcohol is similar. Banning it didn't work well and created a criminal element surrounding it. I believe we have all seen the huge downsides to alcohol in the hands of those who cannot consume in moderation.

I think adults that choose to use THC usually are able to do it in moderation and not have it impact their lives in too much of a negative way. Those persons are typically well established in their careers and have a lot to lose if they get too out of control with it. If you have kids in junior high who begin using it, I believe that it could greatly affect their motivation to study hard and be successful for a large percentage of them, which will impact the next generation. I envision something like Idiocracy with a bunch of people just sitting around, smoking pot and playing video games all day. Technically, they aren't hurting anybody. But if you have an entire generation made up of a large percentage of these types of people, I think the big picture downsides are there. Look at what the opioid epidemic did to rural America in places like West Virginia. I can't even imagine the next generation behind the millennials. Imagine a bunch of people who want to sit around stoned all day and still get undeserved trophies for being generally awesome.

Everybody knows someone who smoked a ton of pot as a kid and still scored 1400 on the SAT and now they're an engineer making six figures. But if we are honest, we know many more who did the same thing and have amounted to not much at all. It is not a horrible drug, but I don't think we can say that it will not have any negative impact. Alcohol is likely far worse, at the moment, because it is ubiquitous in our society and has been legal and accepted for many decades. I think the jury is still out on what a legalized THC America will look like in the long run.

If someone said or even implied that all doctors are onboard that THC is a harmless drug, he or she or ye must not have met ANY of the doctors I worked with when I was working on the commercial side of psychiatric medicine (or in pain/inflammatory medicine). And....here's a newsflash...there's precisely ZERO harmless drugs. None. And anyone who thinks they've got the answers as to the risk levels for THC is delusional (perhaps an induced delusion). I can also say with equal certainty that Phase 2 and Phase 3 drug trials are getting very interesting when having to enroll patients with THC exposure (most of these, if not all of these, are not being conducted in the US)

 

[Hoosierfrog]

not when these kids are still living at home, and their parents have cabinets full of legal opioids prescribed by doctors and zero weed. Kind of makes the decision easy.

Still don’t buy it being used more than weed at the Jr Hi and HS level.

 

[McFroggin]

Still don’t buy it being used more than weed at the Jr Hi and HS level.

Weed is higher.

 

[Shorty]

I used to do drugs. I still do, but I used to too.

 

[ticketfrog123]

Still don’t buy it being used more than weed at the Jr Hi and HS level.

Yeah it’s complete baloney

Source: am in jr. high

 

[netty2424]

You are throwing out random percentages of people that "use" it as something related to addiction?

Johnston LD Monitoring the Future study. 68.2% of US senior have tried alcohol. Are many of them truly addicted? No. Does it mean that it isn't a gateway drug? Absolutely not.

Marijuana today is far more potent than it was in the 1970's. The percent of THC has increased from on average of 1% in the 70's to 9% in 2008. It's likely 10%+ now. The resulting problems have been huge.

Endocannabinoids shape brain development see Galve-Roperh Eur Arch Psychiatry Clin Neuroscience 2009.

THC reduces hippocampal neuron activation causing permanently smaller hippocampi and poorer memory. Changing brain chemistry effects ability to regulate mood, feel pleasure, etc. See Bossong MG Adolescent brain maturation.....in Progress of Neurobiology.

You permanently damage the ability to feel pleasure, so what do you do? You move on to something more potent.

Marijuana use increases the risk of psychosis, anxiety, depression, and schizophrenia by 2-5x. On an individual basis, that doesn't seem big, but across the population, it is incredibly damaging.

Meier et al Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences demonstrated IQ decline that is not recovered. Average decline was 7 points. That is a huge drop.

In 2006, Lynskey published a study showing roughly 16x greater risk of harder drugs after marijuana use. Keep in mind the gateway hypothesis never established a direct progression. Some studies show 1/6th of adolescents will go on to develop dependence in 2-4 years. 2006 Fergusson completed a 25 year longitudinal study showing cannabis is a gateway drug. In 2015, Secades et al Probability and Predictors of the Cannabis Gateway Effect again showed it to be a gateway drug.

As prevalence increases, we are actually seeing marijuana often being used first and transitioning to alcohol and then higher.

With that said, the majority of people who use marijuana, alcohol, nicotine, caffeine, etc. do not go on to use harder substances. That does not make them less of a gateway drug though.

All studies funded by big pharma, I’m assuming. And I don’t mean that to be a disrespectful comment, but how many studies showed a specific result, and 5 years later, there’s a class action lawsuit on TV?

Medical studies are seemingly just as dirty as any other business these days with the pressure to get pills/devices/products to market to recover invested R&D money.

 

[McFroggin]

All studies funded by big pharma, I’m assuming. And I don’t mean that to be a disrespectful comment, but how many studies showed a specific result, and 5 years later, there’s a class action lawsuit on TV?

Medical studies are seemingly just as dirty as any other business these days with the pressure to get pills/devices/products to market to recover invested R&D money.

Wrong.

Name a single drug FDA approved to treat Cannabis addiction in any age group.

Studies I listed were focused on those younger than 18. That is exponentially harder to get FDA approval. Any pharma company throwing money at cannabis research in 13-17 years old would be like burning millions in a dumpster fire.

 

[netty2424]

Wrong.

Name a single drug FDA approved to treat Cannabis addiction in any age group.

Studies I listed were focused on those younger than 18. That is exponentially harder to get FDA approval. Any pharma company throwing money at cannabis research in 13-17 years old would be like burning millions in a dumpster fire.

Yes you’re correct it’s costly and risky, but it’s happening.

Epidiolex manufactured by British pharmaceutical company GW Pharmaceuticals.

FDA approved, Schedule V marijuana derived cannabinoid to treat epilepsy.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/medical-...ials-of-cannabidiol-for-epilepsy/mac-20429606

“Children in the studies have been placed on the medication or a placebo for 12 weeks, with both parents and physicians blinded as to whether the child is receiving active or placebo drug.”

https://www.dea.gov/press-releases/...ex-placed-schedule-v-controlled-substance-act

 

[McFroggin]

Yes you’re correct it’s costly and risky, but it’s happening.

Epidiolex manufactured by British pharmaceutical company GW Pharmaceuticals.

FDA approved, Schedule V marijuana derived cannabinoid to treat epilepsy.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/medical-...ials-of-cannabidiol-for-epilepsy/mac-20429606

“Children in the studies have been placed on the medication or a placebo for 12 weeks, with both parents and physicians blinded as to whether the child is receiving active or placebo drug.”

https://www.dea.gov/press-releases/...ex-placed-schedule-v-controlled-substance-act

It’s NOT happening though. You are changing the subject to drugs that utilize cannabinoid receptors for medicinal use outside of addiction (like epilepsy).

There are no drugs FDA approved to treat cannabis addiction. There are no drugs FDA approved to treat addiction of any kind in adolescents.

If a pharmaceutical company could get FDA approval for cannabis addiction, they wouldn’t even try for indications in teens because they would already have a monopoly.

Commercial research in teen addictions has no monetary value for private companies at this time.

 

[Spike]

I 100% agree people should not start this before 25 (when brain is fully matured). Knowledge of that effect on brain development is based on good science.

I'm 50 and my brain is not that mature.

 

[tcudoc]

I'm 50 and my brain is not that mature.

My latest favorite insult is:
Smooth brain
It's a nice little medically based insult. Those afflicted may actually take it as a compliment.

 

[Eight]

I'm 50 and my brain is not that mature.

just checking, but is that "t" in mature supposed to be an "n"

 

[netty2424]

It’s NOT happening though. You are changing the subject to drugs that utilize cannabinoid receptors for medicinal use outside of addiction (like epilepsy).

There are no drugs FDA approved to treat cannabis addiction. There are no drugs FDA approved to treat addiction of any kind in adolescents.

If a pharmaceutical company could get FDA approval for cannabis addiction, they wouldn’t even try for indications in teens because they would already have a monopoly.

Commercial research in teen addictions has no monetary value for private companies at this time.

I didn’t read your post to say all of those studies were specific to finding a cannabis addiction cure, but moreso changes as a result of use, and that there were no studies at all, anywhere relative to cannabis. I guess I interpreted that a little differently. Apologies.

Is it possible pharma and medical community don’t see a need there because cannabis isn’t really addictive? Serious question. Is it classified as an addictive substance?