FWST: Give Dixon’s predecessor some credit for TCU success

[TopFrog]

FWST: Give Dixon’s predecessor some credit for TCU success

BY Big Steaming Pile
tengel@star-telegram.com

He has received mostly mockery and scorn rather than credit but Trent Johnson deserves due recognition for what is going on with the TCU basketball program.

As the team prepares for its final game of the season — an appearance in the NIT final — a portion of this is because of the man who herded the program through the transition from small time to big time.

“Let’s just cut to the chase right now — you don’t think I’ve been watching?” Johnson said in a phone interview on Wednesday morning. “Of course I’m happy for them. I never had any question about it, I knew they were going to be good this year.”

Read more here: http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/mac-engel/article141554349.html#storylink=cpy

 

[froglash88]

DNR

Never Will!

 

[TopFrog]

Being able to find the right coach, catch lightning in a bottle. Sullivan to Fran to GP, bringing in Schloss, now Dixon after TCU went through several who couldn't get it done. It is making the right hire, finding that right person. TCU has the best major sport coaching triumvirate in the nation.

 

[cdsfrog]

He could recruit. He just couldn't coach that well or develop talent at all

 

[Realtorfrog]

Once in his dog house you couldn't get out! He was a good coach and recruiter just not good at motivating or letting bygones be bygones.

Dixon is a great motivator and coaches them up the entire game.

 

[Deep Purple]

He could recruit. He just couldn't coach that well or develop talent at all

Pretty much what my wife's godson, who's an LSU alum, told me when we hired Johnson. Said he's a great recruiter but not so good at leadership and horrible at X's and O's.

 

[Double V]

How did I know this was a Muck column before I opened the thread?

I have ZERO doubt that CTJ would have "coached" this team straight to last place in the B12, one and done in the Conference tourney, and no NIT invite.

 

[TCUdirtbag]

If TCU wins tonight, we will have doubled our win total from 2016 to 2017. From 12 to 24.

Johnson did a pretty good job recruiting, especially given his limited resources. But his ceiling was low from a coaching standpoint. Without Jamie and the expanded resources he demanded and TCU invested, we'd never be where we are now.

I do give CTJ some deserved credit. He set the table for CJD to be the hero.

 

[Pharm Frog]

I award precisely zero positive credit. Figure we'd be right where we are regardless after getting CJD. If I give any credit, it's for the persistent failure that allowed CDC to go get CJD when the opportunity presented itself.

 

[Prince of Purpoole]

I'm fine with "some" credit; a modicum, no more.

 

[KillerFrog InD KitchenSink]

I definitely think he deserves some credit, We were poised for a better year with all the returning players and getting Robinson. If I'm honest, I think our regular season record would have been about the same. Lets remember we went only 17-14 (6-12) in the regular season, ending with a 7 game losing streak. I think Johnson could have achieved similar results. The difference is Dixon has parlayed that into a very strong postseason. I don't think Johnson does that. That said, Dixon was a loss to OU away (in the Big 12 tourney) from a 17-15 season, an 8 game losing streak and possibly no postseason. That game was the key to the year. Without it, the season suddenly looks very Trent Johnson-ish.

The hire was brilliant for CDC. Obviously Dixon can coach, but it also proves the best time to hire a new guy is when you return a lot. That's hard because there is a tendency to see what a coach can do with returning talent. But the direction he went gives the opportunity to have success right off and gives time for the new coach to recruit instead of just finding warm bodies at the last second if it is a bare cupboard situation.

 

[JogginFrog]

Credit to Muck for making a phone call to get input from CTJ. It was a piece worth writing and I agree with his analysis:
"The Trent Johnson era at TCU was neither a success nor a failure. It was a necessity. Someone had to be the grunt."

I agree that CTJ was neither a great game coach nor talent developer, but the players never stopped playing hard for the guy. That speaks loudest to me in terms of his role in preparation for this year and the Dixon era.

 

[Limp Lizard]

I like the Sullivan to Francione comparison. Sully recruited some excellent players, but it took Francione and GP to make them a good team.
And when Johnson spoke it sounded like his IQ was in triple digits, as opposed to Sully.

 

[RollToad]

He deserves a lot of credit for that amazing KenPom rating.

 

[Casey T]

I definitely think he deserves some credit, We were poised for a better year with all the returning players and getting Robinson. If I'm honest, I think our regular season record would have been about the same. Lets remember we went only 17-14 (6-12) in the regular season, ending with a 7 game losing streak. I think Johnson could have achieved similar results. The difference is Dixon has parlayed that into a very strong postseason. I don't think Johnson does that. That said, Dixon was a loss to OU away (in the Big 12 tourney) from a 17-15 season, an 8 game losing streak and possibly no postseason. That game was the key to the year. Without it, the season suddenly looks very Trent Johnson-ish.

The hire was brilliant for CDC. Obviously Dixon can coach, but it also proves the best time to hire a new guy is when you return a lot. That's hard because there is a tendency to see what a coach can do with returning talent. But the direction he went gives the opportunity to have success right off and gives time for the new coach to recruit instead of just finding warm bodies at the last second if it is a bare cupboard situation.

Disagree. TJ won our team a combined 8 B12 games in 4 years. CJD won 6 in 1 year. An average of 6/yr compared to an average of 2/yr is a 200% increase. CJD was also only 2 wins away from making the tourney, and we had many close (and some unfair imo) losses in that 7 game losing streak. We were better than our record at the end of the year.

I know some will argue that TJ would have done better than his 4 year record shows in year 5, but I disagree and am much happier with our new coach.

 

[JogginFrog]

Dixon also spoke about his relationship with Johnson and perspective on the CTJ era in this interview:
https://georgiatech.rivals.com/news/pastner-and-dixon-talk-nit-championship

 

[KillerFrog InD KitchenSink]

Disagree. TJ won our team a combined 8 B12 games in 4 years. CJD won 6 in 1 year. An average of 6/yr compared to an average of 2/yr is a 200% increase. CJD was also only 2 wins away from making the tourney, and we had many close (and some unfair imo) losses in that 7 game losing streak. We were better than our record at the end of the year.

I know some will argue that TJ would have done better than his 4 year record shows in year 5, but I disagree and am much happier with our new coach.

I think I was clear I am very happy with Dixon and that it was a great move by CDC. I just think if we are honest there would have been some improvement this year with Johnson that would have approached or even equaled the 17-14 (6-12) regular season we had. Maybe 14 to 17 overall wins, 4 to 6 B-12 wins type of a season. That kind of a season from a Johnson coached squad isn't that hard to imagine with Williams back and the addition of Robinson. The KU upset and NIT run are what really are making this season remarkable, and what I have a hard time seeing happening with Johnson.

 

[Limey Frog]

Giving credit for not being able to get talented players ready to win games isn't really how this business works.

 

[Pharm Frog]

I think I was clear I am very happy with Dixon and that it was a great move by CDC. I just think if we are honest there would have been some improvement this year with Johnson that would have approached or even equaled the 17-14 (6-12) regular season we had. This is not what my honest opinion would be -- although I might agree if "some improvement" means a win or two more than the previous abysmal season. I cannot imagine a scenario under which we would have had the record we had nor how competitive we were in the games we lost.

Maybe 14 to 17 overall wins, 4 to 6 B-12 wins type of a season. That kind of a season from a Johnson coached squad isn't that hard to imagine with Williams back and the addition of Robinson. Nearly impossible for me to imagine. Who would have "coached" Williams and Robinson. Who would have overseen the progress of Vlad? Who would have put them in a system that gave them opportunity to win? Methinks you don't give anywhere near the credit to coaching that it deserves in the game of basketball.

The KU upset and NIT run are what really are making this season remarkable, so much more than that make it remarkable IMO and what I have a hard time seeing happening with Johnson.

 

[TCUdirtbag]

For those that won't click Engel links, here are the Johnson quotes from the story:

“Let’s just cut to the chase right now — you don’t think I’ve been watching?” Johnson said in a phone interview on Wednesday morning. “Of course I’m happy for them. I never had any question about it, I knew they were going to be good this year.”

“Everywhere I’ve been, I don’t look in the rearview mirror,” Johnson said.

Johnson still lives in Benbrook with his wife and is busy chasing his three granddaughters. He sounds upbeat and like a man who is not done with coaching.

“I told [Dixon], ‘First of all, congratulations,’ ” Johnson said. “And I said, ‘You’ve got a great group of guys who are battled tested. You’re going to do just fine.’”