• The KillerFrogs

2017 Baseball Season Thread

GoFrog Yourself

GoFrog Yourself

Active Member
Jefffrog1993 said:
At what point does Sarrloos get some blame for pitching issues? He got all the credit last year deservedly so? Also when do you heat Baker back up to pitch in playoffs or do you?
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Y'all need to stop suggesting this. One starter going down and Durbin struggling for the first time is not the end of the world. Bringing in a guy that hasn't pitched in over a year will not help anything. Better to hold out hope that Traver settles in and the mid relief bullpen guys continue to supplement a short start
 
Pharm Frog

Pharm Frog

Full Member
GoFrog Yourself said:
Y'all need to stop suggesting this. One starter going down and Durbin struggling for the first time is not the end of the world. Bringing in a guy that hasn't pitched in over a year will not help anything. Better to hold out hope that Traver settles in and the mid relief bullpen guys continue to supplement a short start
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Agree. Even with the Saturday debacle, the Frogs are 15th in the country in WHIP. 35th in walks allowed. 11th in K-BB ratio. Attempting to decipher non-verbal clues from CJS's recent mound visits, I'm inclined to think that recently the pitchers just haven't been doing what they have been coached to do.
 
Sand Frog

Sand Frog

Active Member
Pharm Frog said:
Agree. Even with the Saturday debacle, the Frogs are 15th in the country in WHIP. 35th in walks allowed. 11th in K-BB ratio. Attempting to decipher non-verbal clues from CJS's recent mound visits, I'm inclined to think that recently the pitchers just haven't been doing what they have been coached to do.
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Agree. Based on the comments in the paper after the Saturday game, I imagine the pitchers got a pretty good tongue lashing and were challenged. I was baffled when Schloss went to get Howard with the 0-2 count after the stolen base, but based on Schloss and Howards actions he was on a very short leash and not holding the runner tight got him pulled. Or maybe it was the kid at the plate was 7 for 11 on the weekend and once the runner got to 2nd Schloss wasn't taking any chances.
 
Pharm Frog

Pharm Frog

Full Member
Sand Frog said:
Agree. Based on the comments in the paper after the Saturday game, I imagine the pitchers got a pretty good tongue lashing and were challenged. I was baffled when Schloss went to get Howard with the 0-2 count after the stolen base, but based on Schloss and Howards actions he was on a very short leash and not holding the runner tight got him pulled. Or maybe it was the kid at the plate was 7 for 11 on the weekend and once the runner got to 2nd Schloss wasn't taking any chances.
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Or maybe it was because the previous time he was up, Howard had him down 0-2 with a runner at second and two outs and threw a belt-high fastball middle-out that got torched for a RBI single. Gutsy coaching decision IMO and I liked it a lot.
 
ftwfrog

ftwfrog

Active Member
Pharm Frog said:
Breaking News

St. Joseph's executed a sacrifice bunt this weekend leaving the Frogs alone in 295th place (which is last among teams that have even one sac bunt). Apparently there are four D1 teams that have not had a single sac bunt this year. Would take too much time to figure out which four those are but pretty sure they are Mosiello University, Mosiello State, Mosiello Tech, and Mosiello A&M.
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I enjoy the humor, and I know there are people who are so pro-bunt this won't strike a chord at all, but let me play Devils advocate for the anti-bunting faction. Funny thing is, during a game I'm always calling to lay down the bunt, but I totally understand why managers are against it.


When you bunt you are hypothetically:
1-giving the other team an out.
2-taking away the chance of a big inning
3-taking the bat out of one of your players hands.
4- bailing out the pitcher. (There is at least one runner on base. Who says that pitcher won't walk you, or groove a fastball?)
5- assuming that players will execute the bunt and on the next batter.

I think all would agree you don't ever have Baker, Skoug, Watson, Warner or Wade bunt. Don't take the bat out of their hands. Heading into the season you'd put Barzilli in that category. So that now leaves 3 or 4 guys in the lineup that you would bunt with. For me it has to be 100% the right situation. Tied in the ninth inning (at home). If you're down one in the 8th, why give the other team outs? Get two or three runs & take the lead.

Some suggest that when you bunt a runner to third you are guaranteeing yourself one run. I disagree. There are still many things that have to go right. First, you must get down a good bunt and this takes practice. Sounds like we don't practice it, so why should we do it. Yesterday in the TT game they were tied in the ninth with a runner on 2nd and laid down a pretty decent bunt. The lead runner was thrown out at third. Now you just handed the other team an out.

2nd, the next batter up must hit a fly ball. Any other outcome and you were better off taking your chances let 3 guys swing away.

Essentially with our lineup, runner on 2nd with no outs. I'd take my chances and let our next 3 guys try to get a hit, rather than hand the team an out and let one guy try to hit a fly ball or wait for a passed ball.

It's a fun discussion. Go frogs.
 
F

f_399

Active Member
Sand Frog said:
based on Schloss and Howards actions he was on a very short leash and not holding the runner tight got him pulled. Or maybe it was the kid at the plate was 7 for 11 on the weekend and once the runner got to 2nd Schloss wasn't taking any chances.
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Was wondering what that was about, Howard was ahead 0-2 when he was pulled?
 
Pharm Frog

Pharm Frog

Full Member
ftwfrog said:
I enjoy the humor, and I know there are people who are so pro-bunt this won't strike a chord at all, but let me play Devils advocate for the anti-bunting faction. Funny thing is, during a game I'm always calling to lay down the bunt, but I totally understand why managers are against it.


When you bunt you are hypothetically:
1-giving the other team an out.
2-taking away the chance of a big inning
3-taking the bat out of one of your players hands.
4- bailing out the pitcher. (There is at least one runner on base. Who says that pitcher won't walk you, or groove a fastball?)
5- assuming that players will execute the bunt and on the next batter.

I think all would agree you don't ever have Baker, Skoug, Watson, Warner or Wade bunt. Don't take the bat out of their hands. Heading into the season you'd put Barzilli in that category. So that now leaves 3 or 4 guys in the lineup that you would bunt with. For me it has to be 100% the right situation. Tied in the ninth inning (at home). If you're down one in the 8th, why give the other team outs? Get two or three runs & take the lead.

Some suggest that when you bunt a runner to third you are guaranteeing yourself one run. I disagree. There are still many things that have to go right. First, you must get down a good bunt and this takes practice. Sounds like we don't practice it, so why should we do it. Yesterday in the TT game they were tied in the ninth with a runner on 2nd and laid down a pretty decent bunt. The lead runner was thrown out at third. Now you just handed the other team an out.

2nd, the next batter up must hit a fly ball. Any other outcome and you were better off taking your chances let 3 guys swing away.

Essentially with our lineup, runner on 2nd with no outs. I'd take my chances and let our next 3 guys try to get a hit, rather than hand the team an out and let one guy try to hit a fly ball or wait for a passed ball.

It's a fun discussion. Go frogs.
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  • They still have to make the play to record the out. But they should -- kinda the idea of sacrifice. Was it last year or the prior year that the Frogs looked like the Keystone cops trying to defend the bunt?
  • Doesn't take the bat out of anyone's hands. They still have it and the bunt can be a strategic weapon.
  • Double play ground balls can also stall a potential big inning.
  • Shouldn't be bunting balls (unless suicide squeeze). Potential for walk remains. Pitcher should groove a fastball (if they can) unless its a known squeeze.
  • I would not agree with that list per se. Baker = hard no. Skoug = nope. Watson = no (seen that already this year). Warner = possible. Wade = harder to decide because of his injury over the summer so probably no (plus he's pretty skilled at pulling the ball when needed)
  • Note: Baylor led off with a double in one of the late innings yesterday. Bunted him the 3rd. Pop out to 1B and flew out to LF. Not a big fan of bunting a runner to third with no outs. No guarantees in baseball.
  • Don't think anyone really knows how much we practice bunting.
  • Another consideration = our rather dubious record of in-play baserunning.
  • I think the bunt needs to be in your situational arsenal.
 
Pharm Frog

Pharm Frog

Full Member
jake102 said:
My opinion. I would never use it in innings 1-7. But in a tie ball game, bottom 9th, runner on 2nd & no outs.... I would love to be able to bunt.
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I would consider using it earlier than that if I felt it would give the team a strategic advantage. Big difference to a struggling starter having a one-run lead versus a two or three run lead (or a one-run lead when the game was tied). Too many factors to say for sure or for sure not.
 
cdsfrog

cdsfrog

Active Member
GoFrog Yourself said:
Y'all need to stop suggesting this. One starter going down and Durbin struggling for the first time is not the end of the world. Bringing in a guy that hasn't pitched in over a year will not help anything. Better to hold out hope that Traver settles in and the mid relief bullpen guys continue to supplement a short start
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I don't want that but let's not pretend our pitching is a small issue. It's the worst in probably a decade. Imagine our era with metal bats. Probably near 4.5+

We are giving up 4.35 runs a game. Bullpen is still usually solid. Hopefully that's a fluke.
 
Pharm Frog

Pharm Frog

Full Member
cdsfrog said:
I don't want that but let's not pretend our pitching is a small issue. It's the worst in probably a decade. Imagine our era with metal bats. Probably near 4.5+

We are giving up 4.35 runs a game. Bullpen is still usually solid. Hopefully that's a fluke.
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Yes...we are giving up more runs this year than in prior years under BBCOR. Most teams are (not Oregon State for sure). A lot of this is in the disproportionately high scoring first inning runs allowed (and it could be worse as we've wiggled out of first inning jams several times). We are also scoring at our highest clip in the BBCOR era (and that's with playing a large number of games where we only batted in 8 innings). Pre-BBCOR I would suggest that our runs allowed would be well over 4.5 RPG. I don't think there's any doubt that the stitching has had an impact.
 
Pharm Frog

Pharm Frog

Full Member
TCUFROG1998 said:
So who we thinking will start tomorrow?
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I figure Horton but who knows? Need to be up for this game. This SFA team dropped a road game to Baylor last week 2-1 and I don't think we stifled the Baylor bats to that extent even at our place. Baylor had to hit back-to-back jacks (ha ha) in the B9 to win that game.

I know three of their kids pretty well. Chad Dunlop was perhaps the best defensive second-baseman I've ever seen in high school. A couple of MLB scouts shared this opinion. He just couldn't hit much more than his weight in high school. Doesn't look like he's playing that much. Stevie Thompson is lightning fast and appears to be playing even less. The Evans kid (from Ponca-Northern) is a really good ballplayer and batting a ridiculous .409. Figure we see Nouis...senior lefty from San Jac.
 
jake102

jake102

Active Member
Pharm Frog said:
Chad Dunlop was perhaps the best defensive second-baseman I've ever seen in high school. A couple of MLB scouts shared this opinion. He just couldn't hit much more than his weight in high school. Doesn't look like he's playing that much. Stevie Thompson is lightning fast and appears to be playing even less. .
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So......
 
Pharm Frog

Pharm Frog

Full Member
jake102 said:
So......
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Dunlop looks like he's being used as a pinch runner and defensive replacement now. I would have thought that Stevie would have been a runner but he may be hurt according to some folks up here. I just looked him up and cannot believe what I saw. There's no doubt that kids who run through Cowley County seem to get big rather quickly. Interpret that in any way you like. Shutting down Evans will a key. He's a lefty so hopefully Horton (if he starts) will have and advantage. Kid can really hit the ball.
 
CountryFrog

CountryFrog

Active Member
Hate it or love it, this ultra-aggressive strategy at the plate and on the bases (sometimes crossing over into insane recklessness) has resulted in helping us to Omaha the last two years and a top 5 team this year. So don't expect it to change anytime soon.

Some situational exceptions could be beneficial, but just like in football where we're never going under center with 3 TE's and two backs in any goal line or short yardage situation ever, we're likely never going to put another sacrifice bunt down this year. That's the attitude I'm going with.
 

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